Bibliography in reports (round 2)

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Bibliography in reports (round 2)

Brian Matherly
Thanks to everyone who has been participating in this discussion. I've taken some feedback and tried something new. This is me thinking outside the box.

The attached report has the same information as the last one. Here are there differences in how it is displayed:

1) I've thrown out sourceRef text - it is clear it doesn't belong here.
2) For any references that have page or date information, that information is displayed on a single line after the source in the endnotes section. If more than one sourceRef exists, they are separated by a semi-colon. So you would see "a: p.5; b: p.6".

I'm not sure if this is a final solution, but I'm trying different things out. Feedback is welcome.

BTW: If anyone has any ides of how this should work, please feel free to speak up.

~Brian




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=?utf-8?q?det=5Fancestor=5Freport.odt?= (7K) Download Attachment
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Re: Bibliography in reports (round 2)

bm-5
Yes, this is in line with what date/page are supposed to be used for. I
like it.

Note however that at least one report should print out whatever notes a person
has attached to sourceref.

I'm not so sure however which report that is needed for, and how to
present it.
With multiple notes this could seriously make your report longer.
Also, of internet sources, I copy/paste the text in a note of the
source object
(can't have the internet page disappearing or becoming paying only after using
it!), making these sources have very long notes. However, this text of the
source should not really be repeated on most reports, as the text has
been used
to enter the data. Eg, text of the marriage record of John and Jane
must not be
printed on a report as it is clear from the marriage event they are married.

Benny

Quoting Brian Matherly <[hidden email]>:

> Thanks to everyone who has been participating in this discussion.
> I've taken some feedback and tried something new. This is me thinking
> outside the box.
>
> The attached report has the same information as the last one. Here
> are there differences in how it is displayed:
>
> 1) I've thrown out sourceRef text - it is clear it doesn't belong here.
> 2) For any references that have page or date information, that
> information is displayed on a single line after the source in the
> endnotes section. If more than one sourceRef exists, they are
> separated by a semi-colon. So you would see "a: p.5; b: p.6".
>
> I'm not sure if this is a final solution, but I'm trying different
> things out. Feedback is welcome.
>
> BTW: If anyone has any ides of how this should work, please feel free
> to speak up.
>
> ~Brian
>
>
>
>



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Re: Bibliography in reports (round 2)

Duncan Lithgow-2
Hi Brian et al.

Looks good, nice to see this getting some attention just when I need it.
I decided not to follow this thread, so ignore my comment if it's been
discussed to death, but I can't quite follow the punctuation logic. I
assume the source title is "Birth, Death and Marriage Records of Python
County" and the author is Dr. Won Derwhy. I think then that a more
standard way of presenting it would be:

Endnotes

1. Dr. Won Derwhy, 1999 "Birth, Death and Marriage Records of Python
County" GEA Publishing.

2. Currently in the posession of Jose Smith, "Edwin Michael Smith
Marriage Certificate"

3. An online list of software engineers, "www.softwareengineersrus.com"
a: 2003-12-12

4. Monty University Yearbook Committee, "1984 Monty University Yearbook"
a: p. 22; b: pp. 5,12-14,22

5. "Marriage Certificae"



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Re: Bibliography in reports (round 2)

bm-5
Indeed,

in references, the standard is first name, then title.
Note that for many genealogical sources the author is not fixed (civil
recoreds,
...), and will hence be an empty field.

Benny

Quoting Duncan Lithgow <[hidden email]>:

> Hi Brian et al.
>
> Looks good, nice to see this getting some attention just when I need it.
> I decided not to follow this thread, so ignore my comment if it's been
> discussed to death, but I can't quite follow the punctuation logic. I
> assume the source title is "Birth, Death and Marriage Records of Python
> County" and the author is Dr. Won Derwhy. I think then that a more
> standard way of presenting it would be:
>
> Endnotes
>
> 1. Dr. Won Derwhy, 1999 "Birth, Death and Marriage Records of Python
> County" GEA Publishing.
>
> 2. Currently in the posession of Jose Smith, "Edwin Michael Smith
> Marriage Certificate"
>
> 3. An online list of software engineers, "www.softwareengineersrus.com"
> a: 2003-12-12
>
> 4. Monty University Yearbook Committee, "1984 Monty University Yearbook"
> a: p. 22; b: pp. 5,12-14,22
>
> 5. "Marriage Certificae"
>
>
>
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Re: Bibliography in reports (round 2)

Brian Matherly
In reply to this post by Brian Matherly
Duncan,

Thanks for your feedback.

>Looks good, nice to see this getting some attention just when I need it.
>I decided not to follow this thread, so ignore my comment if it's been
>discussed to death, but I can't quite follow the punctuation logic. I
>assume the source title is "Birth, Death and Marriage Records of Python
>County" and the author is Dr. Won Derwhy. I think then that a more
>standard way of presenting it would be:
>
>Endnotes
>
>1. Dr. Won Derwhy, 1999 "Birth, Death and Marriage Records of Python
>County" GEA Publishing.

I agree completely. This is in line with the APA format for references. The only issue here is that "1999" (the publishing date) and "GEA Publishing" (the publisher) are both stored in the "Publication Information" field in Gramps (like this: GEA Publishing, 1999"). As such, there is no way to separate them. So, the best I can do is:

    <Author>, "<Title>", <Publication Information>

Note that I"m not displaying "ID", "Abbreviation", "Notes", "Data", "Repositories" or "Gallery".

>
>2. Currently in the posession of Jose Smith, "Edwin Michael Smith
>Marriage Certificate"

This was a terrible example and I regret using it. The text "Currently in the posession of Jose Smith" is contained in the Publication Information field. But it shouldn't be used that way. I've learned a lot about sources since I started experimenting. A better way to do it would be to make "Jose Smith" a repository and add the source to that repository.

>3. An online list of software engineers, "www.softwareengineersrus.com";
>a: 2003-12-12

In this case, "An online list of software engineers" is in the publication information. Again, I'm not sure if that is the best place for it.

>4. Monty University Yearbook Committee, "1984 Monty University Yearbook"
>a: p. 22; b: pp. 5,12-14,22

I agree

>5. "Marriage Certificae"

I agree

Thanks so much for your feedback. I think I will switch to this format for Sources:

    <Author>, "<Title>", <Publication Information>

~Brian





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Re: Bibliography in reports (round 2)

Brian Matherly
In reply to this post by Brian Matherly
Benny,

>in references, the standard is first name, then title.

Yes. I think I will switch to this format:
    <Author>, "<Title>", <Publication Information>

>Note that for many genealogical sources the author is not fixed (civil
>recoreds,
>...), and will hence be an empty field.

Duly noted. In that case, I will use this format:
    "<Title>", <Publication Information>

~Brian




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Re: Bibliography in reports (round 2)

Stefan Björk-2
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Brian,

> Yes. I think I will switch to this format:
>     <Author>, "<Title>", <Publication Information>

I frequently use the "abbreviaton" field for storing identification
numbers of sources (such as "SE/VALA/01542/A I a/88"). In case of an
non-empty abbreviation field, I'd like the format to be:

  <Author>, "<Title>", <Publication Information> (<Abbreviation>).

I would also propose italic font style instead of quotes, but this is
mostly a matter of personal taste. :)

Stefan

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Re: Bibliography in reports (round 2)

bm-5
AArrhhh!

I remember the endless discussions when I still was a software engineer wit
h
users using a datafield in an inappropriate way, and then requesting we cha
nge
reports/interface to accommodate their mis-behaviour.

The good answer to this is the following:
1. Abbreviation is the short form of the title, for use in reports where on
e
does not want spend much place for referencing the source. Please use it as
such.
2. If you need a new field in the source record, you should do a feature
request, and argument your case.

In your case, the identification number of a source is already present, so
no
need to ask a new field for that: the call number in the repository referen
ce!
That is, a source will have different ID in different libraries.

Benny

Quoting Stefan Björk <[hidden email]>:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Brian,
>
>> Yes. I think I will switch to this format:
>>     <Author>, "<Title>", <Publication Information>
>
> I frequently use the "abbreviaton" field for storing identification
> numbers of sources (such as "SE/VALA/01542/A I a/88"). In case of an
> non-empty abbreviation field, I'd like the format to be:
>
>  <Author>, "<Title>", <Publication Information> (<Abbreviation>).
>
> I would also propose italic font style instead of quotes, but this is
> mostly a matter of personal taste. :)
>
> Stefan
>
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux)
> Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
>
> iD8DBQFGVYqLzv8VI4RnlpQRAlKxAJ9VaEYDNCKvFV4qHGfoLtBfko2adQCfQpAK
> lgP/Ih9QXxzgXMlNUsSbtMw=
> =Qb5U
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express
> Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take
> control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now.
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>



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Re: Bibliography in reports (round 2)

jerome
Maybe Stefan started using GRAMPS with a previous version (1.0.x or
2.0.x), without repository ...


[hidden email] a écrit :

> AArrhhh!
>
> I remember the endless discussions when I still was a software engineer with
> users using a datafield in an inappropriate way, and then requesting we cha
> nge reports/interface to accommodate their mis-behaviour.
>
> The good answer to this is the following:
> 1. Abbreviation is the short form of the title, for use in reports where on
> e
> does not want spend much place for referencing the source. Please use it as
> such.
> 2. If you need a new field in the source record, you should do a feature
> request, and argument your case.
>
> In your case, the identification number of a source is already present, so
> no need to ask a new field for that: the call number in the repository referen
> ce! That is, a source will have different ID in different libraries.
>
> Benny
>
> Quoting Stefan Bj�rk <[hidden email]>:
>
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>> Hash: SHA1
>>
>> Brian,
>>
>>> Yes. I think I will switch to this format:
>>>     <Author>, "<Title>", <Publication Information>
>> I frequently use the "abbreviaton" field for storing identification
>> numbers of sources (such as "SE/VALA/01542/A I a/88"). In case of an
>> non-empty abbreviation field, I'd like the format to be:
>>
>>  <Author>, "<Title>", <Publication Information> (<Abbreviation>).
>>
>> I would also propose italic font style instead of quotes, but this is
>> mostly a matter of personal taste. :)
>>
>> Stefan

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Re: Bibliography in reports (round 2)

Stefan Björk
In reply to this post by bm-5
> AArrhhh!

Relax! All I sent was a mail, right? And since I have never been able to
find any documentation that explicitly tells how to use different fields
(such as the description field in events) I have had to guess, ok? Sorry
for misusing Gramps due to lack of mind-reading abilities.

> That is, a source will have different ID in different libraries.

Actually, no. The ID is the ID of the original archive, stored at a
specific library. There are microfilm copies in several other libraries,
with specific call numbers. But never mind.

Stefan

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Re: Bibliography in reports (round 2)

Brian Matherly
In reply to this post by Brian Matherly
Stefan,

>> Yes. I think I will switch to this format:
>>     <Author>, "<Title>", <Publication Information>
>
>I frequently use the "abbreviaton" field for storing identification
>numbers of sources (such as "SE/VALA/01542/A I a/88"). In case of an
>non-empty abbreviation field, I'd like the format to be:
>
>  <Author>, "<Title>", <Publication Information> (<Abbreviation>).

I can support that.

>I would also propose italic font style instead of quotes, but this is
>mostly a matter of personal taste. :)

I was thinking about that. I've seen italic or underline. When I get to that point, I'll see how much work it would be. It probably won't be that bad.

~Brian




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Re: Bibliography in reports (round 2)

Duncan Lithgow-2
In reply to this post by Brian Matherly

> Thanks so much for your feedback. I think I will switch to this format for Sources:
>
>     <Author>, "<Title>", <Publication Information>
Bearing in mind that some like quotation marks and some prefer italics,
I assume you'll use separate tags for the different elements in OOo.
Then users can easily set their prefered style with a template document.

Just some thoughts.

Duncan


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