Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

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Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

emma9158
In my ancestral research, I'm using two programs, Gramps and a swedish
program. Both have their advantages and disadvantages, which is why I am
maintaining my ancestor tree in both.

As Gramps is superior when it comes to importing GEDCOM-files correctly, I
normally work in my swedish program and then export to Gramps with GEDCOM.

However, every time I do this, I'm facing one minor but very time consuming
problem: in Gramps, all the citations from the imported datas are set to
Confidence: VERY LOW.
This, I have to edit manually, and it takes forever.

Is there a way to mass-edit the confidence level to "Normal" without having
to do it for every post? It is possible to do this with titles, where all
titles are by default imported as "Nobility titles" but I can switch it to
"profession" with one click. But I haven't found a way to do the same with
confidence levels (and I honestly do not understand why it defaults to "Very
low" instead of "normal" when importing).

Many thanks in advance.
Emma Marie




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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

Brad Rogers
On Wed, 19 Jun 2019 12:01:42 -0500 (CDT)
emma9158 <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hello emma9158,

>Is there a way to mass-edit the confidence level to "Normal" without
>having to do it for every post? It is possible to do this with titles,

Not within Gramps, AFAIAA.

>do the same with confidence levels (and I honestly do not understand
>why it defaults to "Very low" instead of "normal" when importing).

Undoubtedly there are people here that can tell, but to do so, they'd
more than likely need to see an extract from the GEDCOM you're importing.
Since the problem applies to everything imported, just the details of one
person should suffice.

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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

emma9158
StinaLisaLi.ged
<http://gramps.1791082.n4.nabble.com/file/t375905/StinaLisaLi.ged>  

Thank you for the reply.
I have now added a small GEDCOM-file where I know every citation ended up as
of Very Low confidence. (Hope this works, I haven't attached any files here
before)
Emma Marie



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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

emma9158
I'm sorry, I don't think it worked to upload my Gedcom as an attachment here.
So I put it here instead:
http://lovkullen.net/Bygd/StinaLisaLi.ged

Emma Marie



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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

Ron Johnson
In reply to this post by emma9158
On 6/19/19 12:54 PM, emma9158 wrote:
StinaLisaLi.ged
<http://gramps.1791082.n4.nabble.com/file/t375905/StinaLisaLi.ged>  

Thank you for the reply. 
I have now added a small GEDCOM-file where I know every citation ended up as
of Very Low confidence. (Hope this works, I haven't attached any files here
before)
Emma Marie

How confident (pun intended) are you in editing a Gramps backup file?  If so, then you could "fix" it in a text editor. 

It would entail :
  1. Taking a no-media backup.  Simple enough.
  2. Adding a .gz extension.
  3. Uncompressing it with gzip if you're on Linux, or 7zip if Windows.
  4. Editing the uncompressed file with -- if Windows -- something like Notepad++.  You'd have to replace all instances of "<confidence>3</confidence>" with "<confidence>2</confidence>".
  5. Create a new tree.
  6. Import the edited .gramps files into this new tree.
  7. Verify that the Confidence levels are what you want.  (I might have gotten the number values wrong.)


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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

Ron Johnson
In reply to this post by emma9158
On 6/19/19 1:02 PM, emma9158 wrote:
> I'm sorry, I don't think it worked to upload my Gedcom as an attachment here.
> So I put it here instead:
> http://lovkullen.net/Bygd/StinaLisaLi.ged

The original location worked for me.  (At least, it appeared to.)

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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

GRAMPS - User mailing list
In reply to this post by emma9158
Emma Marie,

You might find it easiest to edit the GED file.

Here a process to try.

In your Swedish program, create a new tree containing 1 dummy person with a profession and 3 citations. Export to a GEDcom.

Import into a new Gramps tree (with import tagging turned off in preferences). 
Change the Nobility title to Occupation & give the dummy a Title, change the last 2 of the citation confidences - 1 to Normal & the other to Very High.

Export to GEDCOM & again to GED2.

You could inspect them now to see the differenced. But instead, try importing each into the Swedish program and see if the changed data is carried through. And, if so, see if they expect it to be in a different place than you've been using. 

This will help in a number of ways. You can quickly correct a user methodology problem.

If it is a GEDcom import/e port compatibility problem, it points to which side the issue falls so a bug report can bee filed with the right team. And you might be able to do a couple simple Find&Replace operations on the GEDcom before importing into Gramps ... after identifying the differences.

-Brian

On Wed, Jun 19, 2019 at 12:22, emma9158
In my ancestral research, I'm using two programs, Gramps and a swedish
program. Both have their advantages and disadvantages, which is why I am
maintaining my ancestor tree in both.

As Gramps is superior when it comes to importing GEDCOM-files correctly, I
normally work in my swedish program and then export to Gramps with GEDCOM.

However, every time I do this, I'm facing one minor but very time consuming
problem: in Gramps, all the citations from the imported datas are set to
Confidence: VERY LOW.
This, I have to edit manually, and it takes forever.

Is there a way to mass-edit the confidence level to "Normal" without having
to do it for every post? It is possible to do this with titles, where all
titles are by default imported as "Nobility titles" but I can switch it to
"profession" with one click. But I haven't found a way to do the same with
confidence levels (and I honestly do not understand why it defaults to "Very
low" instead of "normal" when importing).

Many thanks in advance.
Emma Marie




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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

Brad Rogers
In reply to this post by emma9158
On Wed, 19 Jun 2019 12:54:16 -0500 (CDT)
emma9158 <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hello emma9158,

><http://gramps.1791082.n4.nabble.com/file/t375905/StinaLisaLi.ged>  

A quick look shows that in the GED you have QUAY 0, where QUAY = Quality
of Data.  I'm no expert, but that looks like the source of the problem.  
So, your data export from whatever that "Swedish program" you use needs
to be tweaked to avoid the problem completely.  That is, export to GED
with either a QUAY value of 2 (1) or no QUAY values at all.  If two
proves incorrect, try other values.

As others have suggested, you could mass edit either the GDECOM before
import, or mass edit the Gramps XML.  However, that's really only a
stopgap measure.

If you want to read more about the QUAY value, do so at;
http://wiki-en.genealogy.net/GEDCOM/QUAY-Tag

(1) I'm guessing a bit, QUAY values can range from 0-3 and Gramps has 5
confidence levels.  Therefore, the two terms aren't exactly analogous.

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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

Peter Flynn
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Hash: SHA256

On 19/06/2019 19:53, Brad Rogers wrote:
[...]
> As others have suggested, you could mass edit either the GDECOM
> before import, or mass edit the Gramps XML.  However, that's
> really only a stopgap measure.

Editing the XML is not that hard, but in this case it would certainly
be a stopgap.

I recently resurrected an old graphical DTD design package (Near&Far)
so I pushed the Gramps DTD into it, and came up with screenshots of
the principal parts of a Gramps XML document which are now available
at http://xml.silmaril.ie/gramps-doc/ (Apologies for the low
resolution: the software was installed on a 1024×768 Windows XP system
— I know it runs under Codeweavers WINE so I will eventually make
better res.)

Armed with an understanding of the name of the element types, it is
possible to use utilities like LT-XML2
(https://www.ltg.ed.ac.uk/software/ltxml2/) to query a Gramps XML much
in the same way as you would query a database, and there are utilities
for inspecting and changing values. More sophisticated queries can be
done with XQuery or XSLT. This can be invaluable when data-cleaning, eg

$ lxprintf -e placeobj "%s\n" @type data.gramps.xml |\
  sort | uniq -c | sort -k 1nr

     49 Unknown
     39 Building
     29 Town
     27 City
     12 Parish
      8 Street
      5 Village
      4 Borough
      4 County
      2 Country
      1 Department
      1 District
      1 Locality
      1 Municipality
      1 Province

I can see I have 49 Unknown place types to sort out, so I can print
out the contents to review:

$ lxgrep 'placeobj[@type="Unknown"]' data.gramps.xml

<placeobj xmlns="http://gramps-project.org/xml/1.7.1/" type="Unknown"
id="P0005" change="1544808619" handle="_dd7112682975bbfacba672339af">
      <ptitle>Coventry</ptitle>
      <pname value="Coventry"/>
    </placeobj>
(and so on, all 49 of them)

Peter
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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

emma9158
In reply to this post by Brad Rogers
Many thanks for this suggestion, Brad.

I read up on QUAY and then did what you suggested.

It worked - almost.

As you say, the existing values of QUAY are 0-3.
In my GEDCOM export, the value was set to 0, i.e. the reason for why
Confidence = very low appeared in Gramps.

However, Gramps has 5 different values instead of 4.
The outcome was therefore:
QUAY 0 == Confidence VERY LOW in Gramps
QUAY 1 == Confidence LOW in Gramps
QUAY 2 == Confidence HIGH in Gramps

So, like you already stated, it seems that Gramps is not programmed to work
with the QUAY values.

Else, this would have been such a simple and nice solution.

Emma Marie





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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

emma9158
In reply to this post by GRAMPS - User mailing list
Thank you for the reply, Brian,

After already trying out editing QUAY values in the GEDCOM export from my
swedish program (which didn't fully work, as Gramps doesn't follow the QUAY
standard with 4 values, and therefore I couldn't achieve the confidence
value NORMAL), I'm now going to try your approach. It seems less daunting to
edit GEDCOM-files than to edit Gramps backup files.

[quote]You could inspect them now to see the differenced. But instead, try
importing each into the Swedish program and see if the changed data is
carried through. And, if so, see if they expect it to be in a different
place than you've been using.

This will help in a number of ways. You can quickly correct a user
methodology problem.

If it is a GEDcom import/e port compatibility problem, it points to which
side the issue falls so a bug report can bee filed with the right team. And
you might be able to do a couple simple Find&Replace operations on the
GEDcom before importing into Gramps ... after identifying the
differences.[/quote]

I would say that a huge part of the problem is within the swedish program I
am using. Min Släkt http://www.dannbergsdata.se/ is extremely user-friendly
and has (IMO of course) a superb Graphics overview. However, when it comes
to storing sources, the program is limited to one source per event, which
means that one has to use various "personal creative solutions" in order to
store the sources. Of course this doesn't make compatibility with Gramps
easier.

But I will definitely do some experiementing using your suggestion and then
report back here.

Emma Marie



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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

Brad Rogers
In reply to this post by emma9158
On Thu, 20 Jun 2019 04:10:18 -0500 (CDT)
emma9158 <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hello emma9158,

>So, like you already stated, it seems that Gramps is not programmed to
>work with the QUAY values.

I prefer to say that Gramps has finer resolution.   :-)

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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

emma9158
In reply to this post by emma9158
HA!!

I figured out how to do it, with some trial and error using the various
suggestions you have all given me here.

It turns out that when you export a GEDCOM from Gramps, the citations with
confidence NORMAL has NO line for QUAY.
I.e. if you have a citation with confidence value LOW, there will be a line
with QUAY 1 below the SOURCE line. If you have a citation with confidence
value HIGH, there will be a line with QUAY 2.
But if you have a citation with confidence value NORMAL, the QUAY line is
non-existing.

So, I simply went back to my export GEDCOM (from my swedish program) and
changed the line
QUAY 1
to
; QUAY 1

and Gramps imported this correctly, with the confidence value NORMAL.

So, although I should test a bit more to ensure there are no unexpected
problems, I'd say this solves the problem.

However, it would of course be incredibly nice with a Gramps tool that made
it possible to mass-change the value within Gramps rather than having to
edit GEDCOM-files.

Thank you all so much for your replies, I have previously never investigade
the GEDCOM-files, and I feel I have gathered new, interesting knowledge from
this experiment, and will probably try to learn more now that I have
started.

Emma Marie



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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

Peter Merchant
Well Done Emma. Perhaps someone could add this to the gramps Wiki to help future users with the same problem.
Peter M.

On 20/06/2019 11:27, emma9158 wrote:
> HA!!
>
> I figured out how to do it, with some trial and error using the various
> suggestions you have all given me here.
>


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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

Ron Johnson
In reply to this post by Brad Rogers
On 6/20/19 4:43 AM, Brad Rogers wrote:
> On Thu, 20 Jun 2019 04:10:18 -0500 (CDT)
> emma9158 <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Hello emma9158,
>
>> So, like you already stated, it seems that Gramps is not programmed to
>> work with the QUAY values.
> I prefer to say that Gramps has finer resolution.   :-)

Or that it's skeptical of the quality of most GEDCOM files... :)


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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

GRAMPS - User mailing list
In reply to this post by Peter Merchant
Well done indeed, Emma! This has been an interesting maillist thread.

Perhaps you could add a "MinSläkt (Swedish: MyFamily)" subsection to the "Import from another genealogy program" Gramps wiki page?
(To find this page, I googled 
     quay site:gramps-project.org/wiki
It was the 4th entry & was the most recently updated.)

The subsection for Family Tree Maker 2005 & Heredis noted that these programs also had Quay idiosyncracies in their GEDcom. And how to compensate for those idiosyncracies.
----------
The QUAY tag entry in the GenWiki is interesting reading too.  
"Agreements for QUAY
The agreements for QUAY are derived from the discussion on the Gedcom-L. They were decided by a vote of the program authors of the list."

It seems that Gramps has adopted its own interpretation of 'Normal' for Confidence. Since this is a default, internally we might call it 'unassessed' and note is a NULL value. Actually having ANY value means that the quality will have been evaluated.

-Brian

On Thu, Jun 20, 2019 at 6:10, Peter Merchant
Well Done Emma. Perhaps someone could add this to the gramps Wiki to help future users with the same problem.
Peter M.

On 20/06/2019 11:27, emma9158 wrote:
> HA!!
>
> I figured out how to do it, with some trial and error using the various
> suggestions you have all given me here.
>


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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

emma9158
Thank you!

Of course I could write a short how-to on exporting from Min Släkt to
Gramps. There are in fact some other cave-ates that also should be pointed
out (like: never, ever import place data from Min släkt together with person
data; the place data will be repeated for every event that has been recorded
for someone in that area, which mean that if your family has lived in the
same area for a longer time, you can have each place information entry
repeated litterally thousands of times...).
I have requested an account on the wiki, so when (if?) it is approved, I'll
write and post something in the suggested section.

Thank you all for your help
Emma Marie



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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

enno
Hi Emma,

> There are in fact some other cave-ates that also should be pointed
> out (like: never, ever import place data from Min släkt together with person
> data; the place data will be repeated for every event that has been recorded
> for someone in that area, which mean that if your family has lived in the
> same area for a longer time, you can have each place information entry
> repeated litterally thousands of times...).

Can you explain what you mean? As far as I know, Gramps' GEDCOM import
only creates one entry for PLAC lines that have the same contents, so
what you wrote above looks like a bug.

Regards,

Enno




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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

emma9158
Hi Enno,


enno wrote
> Can you explain what you mean? As far as I know, Gramps' GEDCOM import
> only creates one entry for PLAC lines that have the same contents, so
> what you wrote above looks like a bug.

I'm sorry, I expressed myself wrongly.
It is Min Släkt that *exports* the text information associated to places
every time a place is used in an event related to a person.
Gramps imports the place data from the GEDCOM. If I for instance have
written a short text about Malmö that should be displayed on the page for
Malmö, this text will be exported with every person that has any event
related to Malmö. So, if I have 50 births and 50 deaths in Malmö, Min Släkt
will export the text on the Malmö page 100 times, and Gramps will of course
import all these instances. Hardly a bug in Gramps, but vital to bear in
mind when exporting from Min Släkt (I haven't contacted the author about
this, as it was only yesterday that I, with help from the people here,
learnt how easily I can browse the GEDCOM file and thereby pinpoint the
problem).

Emma Marie





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Re: Citations: Is there a way to mass-edit "confidence"?

enno
Hi Emma,

> It is Min Släkt that *exports* the text information associated to
> places every time a place is used in an event related to a person.
> Gramps imports the place data from the GEDCOM. If I for instance have written a short text about Malmö that should be displayed on the page for Malmö, this text will be exported with every person that has any event related to Malmö. So, if I have 50 births and 50 deaths in Malmö, Min Släkt will export the text on the Malmö page 100 times, and Gramps will of course import all these instances. Hardly a bug in Gramps, but vital to bear in mind when exporting from Min Släkt (I haven't contacted the author about this, as it was only yesterday that I, with help from the people here,
> learnt how easily I can browse the GEDCOM file and thereby pinpoint the problem).

Ah, ok, I get it. And looking at the GEDCOM standard, it should be
possible to do it right, but that depends on the GEDCOM exported by your
software.

In most cases, you'll find PLAC records at level 2, meaning that they
appear as

2 PLAC <name>

in a GEDCOM file, preceded by a line like 1 BIRT or 1 DEAT, or some
other event type, 1 MARR for a family.

Now, when you have a note attached to a place, the NOTE line should
start with 3 NOTE, meaning that it belongs to the place. If it starts
with 2 however, it belongs to the last line before it that starts with
1, which is the event, and Gramps will interpret it as an event note.
This is an essential GEDCOM principle, which says that details always
have a number that is higher than the object that they belong to.

If the notes you mention are indeed exported as place details, with a
level number that is 1 bigger than the PLAC line before them, one can
argue that Gramps should attach those to the place, and detect
duplicates. I have not tested whether that actually works, but it seems
to be the most logical.

I just checked the GEDCOM file that you uploaded earlier, and I can't
find any 3 NOTE lines in that, so you will have to check things yourself
on a bigger GEDCOM file.

Regards,

Enno




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