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Collaborative family research

Eckhard Genßmann

Hi all,

I’m using gramps form my private family research since some years and I’m really happy with it. However, as there are few members of my family interested in contributing to the research, I’m considering to change to an environment on web to allow collaboration with others.

I’m thinking on PhpGedView (but this looks very outdated) or Webtrees or something similar.

Nevertheless, I would like to maintain ownership of the data.  Ideally I could monitor what others are adding and then decide to accept this contribution or leave it with the person who added…

 

Is there any experience with that kind of collaboration? How are you handling this? Does it make sense to completely switch to the other tool or how could this work together with Gramps?

What happened with the Gramps project that was started some time ago to develop an online-version?

 

Many thanks,

Eckhard

 

 


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Re: Collaborative family research

Ted Lomatski
Good day Eckhard,

I fully sympathise with you and the frustration you must feel at getting your relatives to contriubute. 

I made a big breakthrough when we celebrated my mother's 80th birthday.  We rented a banquet hall (during February - cold here in Canada, so cheap rent and food), printed out both sides of the family each in a 2.5 metre chart and I blew up 12 pictures from the early 1900s which we also put up on the wall.  I got a great response and had two aunts volunteer to help.

As for collaboration on line, when I uploaded my file, the people that asked to "help" I received no help and found that the information was shared with others.  I knew this because there were errors in the file that I was well aware of.

If you are looking for a site, there is http://www.ancestry.com with a German site at http://www.ancestry.de/

As for keeping control of your database, once you put it out there, that's it.

Cheers,

Ted


On 22 March 2012 17:28, Eckhard Genßmann <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hi all,

I’m using gramps form my private family research since some years and I’m really happy with it. However, as there are few members of my family interested in contributing to the research, I’m considering to change to an environment on web to allow collaboration with others.

I’m thinking on PhpGedView (but this looks very outdated) or Webtrees or something similar.

Nevertheless, I would like to maintain ownership of the data.  Ideally I could monitor what others are adding and then decide to accept this contribution or leave it with the person who added…

 

Is there any experience with that kind of collaboration? How are you handling this? Does it make sense to completely switch to the other tool or how could this work together with Gramps?

What happened with the Gramps project that was started some time ago to develop an online-version?

 

Many thanks,

Eckhard

 

 


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Collaborative family research

LornaJ
Further to Ted's reply below,

I also use Ancestry as my main on-line tool.  Other people cannot change your tree there (so they can't break it for you!), but they can add comments if you allow them to, and if they have their own tree you can accept "Hints" from their tree and copy information fairly easily from one tree to another. Of course, if you make your tree public, or even have it as a private one shared only with your family members, the information you have in your tree is likely to be shared with others.  Ancestry does however have a setting which hides the details of living people in your tree from others, to protect their privacy.

The main difficulty I have found with keeping an online tree on Ancestry and a local one in Gramps is that of keeping them both in sync.

Unfortunately the GEDCOM file which is created from Ancestry does not contain all the information which you might have saved to your online tree (for instance you will lose any images or attached stories), and there is a similar issue if you try to import a GEDCOM into Ancestry which was created by your Gramps tree.

What I now do is always update my data in Ancestry then export from Ancestry to Gramps, and each time I do this I create a new tree in Gramps.  If I get any images etc. through Ancestry I also save them to a folder on my PC so that if ever I cancel my Ancestry membership or something happens to their servers I still have the source data.

The Ancestry site does not store addresses very well. They just get stored as a single text string.  When you import the GEDCOM into Gramps this address string is put into the Place Name field, leaving all the others empty.  That field isn't currently one of the ones referenced by the Gramps Place Completion Tool, so at the moment if you work in the way I have suggested you will lose the ability to query or run Gramps reports based on location unless you are prepared to do a lot of manual "tidying".

This is just my way of working, and it might not suit you, but I hope the above is of some help.

Lorna.


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Ted Lomatski <[hidden email]>
Date: 22 March 2012 22:18
Subject: Re: [Gramps-users] Collaborative family research
To: Eckhard Genßmann <[hidden email]>
Cc: [hidden email]


Good day Eckhard,

I fully sympathise with you and the frustration you must feel at getting your relatives to contriubute. 

I made a big breakthrough when we celebrated my mother's 80th birthday.  We rented a banquet hall (during February - cold here in Canada, so cheap rent and food), printed out both sides of the family each in a 2.5 metre chart and I blew up 12 pictures from the early 1900s which we also put up on the wall.  I got a great response and had two aunts volunteer to help.

As for collaboration on line, when I uploaded my file, the people that asked to "help" I received no help and found that the information was shared with others.  I knew this because there were errors in the file that I was well aware of.

If you are looking for a site, there is http://www.ancestry.com with a German site at http://www.ancestry.de/

As for keeping control of your database, once you put it out there, that's it.

Cheers,

Ted


On 22 March 2012 17:28, Eckhard Genßmann <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hi all,

I’m using gramps form my private family research since some years and I’m really happy with it. However, as there are few members of my family interested in contributing to the research, I’m considering to change to an environment on web to allow collaboration with others.

I’m thinking on PhpGedView (but this looks very outdated) or Webtrees or something similar.

Nevertheless, I would like to maintain ownership of the data.  Ideally I could monitor what others are adding and then decide to accept this contribution or leave it with the person who added…

 

Is there any experience with that kind of collaboration? How are you handling this? Does it make sense to completely switch to the other tool or how could this work together with Gramps?

What happened with the Gramps project that was started some time ago to develop an online-version?

 

Many thanks,

Eckhard

 

 


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Re: Collaborative family research

DS Blank
In reply to this post by Eckhard Genßmann
On Thu, Mar 22, 2012 at 4:28 PM, Eckhard Genßmann
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> I’m using gramps form my private family research since some years and I’m
> really happy with it. However, as there are few members of my family
> interested in contributing to the research, I’m considering to change to an
> environment on web to allow collaboration with others.
>
> I’m thinking on PhpGedView (but this looks very outdated) or Webtrees or
> something similar.
>
> Nevertheless, I would like to maintain ownership of the data.  Ideally I
> could monitor what others are adding and then decide to accept this
> contribution or leave it with the person who added…
>
>
>
> Is there any experience with that kind of collaboration? How are you
> handling this? Does it make sense to completely switch to the other tool or
> how could this work together with Gramps?
>
> What happened with the Gramps project that was started some time ago to
> develop an online-version?

Gramps Connect is still being developed. It has been able to keep up
with recent changes with Gramps data, and this past year demonstrated
that all of Gramps functionality can be replicated on the Web. That
includes imports, reports, and everything else that Gramps does. But
it needs to get a framework for editing data in place. Once that
happens, it should be straightforward to finish it off.

It is an ambitious project to replicate Gramps on the web, but all of
the hard parts have been figured out. I hope that this is the year we
can actually finish it, and deploy it.

-Doug

>
>
> Many thanks,
>
> Eckhard
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> This SF email is sponsosred by:
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>

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Re: Collaborative family research

Doug
In reply to this post by LornaJ
RE:
<quote>
.....When you import
 > the GEDCOM into Gramps this address string is put into the
 > Place Name field, leaving all the others empty.  That field
 > isn't currently one of the ones referenced by the Gramps
 > Place Completion Tool, so at the moment if you work in the
 > way I have suggested you will lose the ability to query or
 > run Gramps reports based on location unless you are prepared
 > to do a lot of manual "tidying".
<endquote>

That's not strictly true. It's in fact the Place Name that
you parse in the Place Completion Tool.
However you're right that you'll probably need to do at
least some  manual "tidying" - how much depends on how
systematic you were in entering the address field in
Ancestry originally. If you weren't very systematic the
tidying needed can be too much to make it worth using the tool.

Doug




On 23/03/12 00:27, b4m wrote:

> Further to Ted's reply below,
>
> I also use Ancestry as my main on-line tool.  Other people
> cannot change your tree there (so they can't break it for
> you!), but they can add comments if you allow them to, and
> if they have their own tree you can accept "Hints" from
> their tree and copy information fairly easily from one tree
> to another. Of course, if you make your tree public, or even
> have it as a private one shared only with your family
> members, the information you have in your tree is likely to
> be shared with others.  Ancestry does however have a setting
> which hides the details of living people in your tree from
> others, to protect their privacy.
>
> The main difficulty I have found with keeping an online tree
> on Ancestry and a local one in Gramps is that of keeping
> them both in sync.
>
> Unfortunately the GEDCOM file which is created from Ancestry
> does not contain all the information which you might have
> saved to your online tree (for instance you will lose any
> images or attached stories), and there is a similar issue if
> you try to import a GEDCOM into Ancestry which was created
> by your Gramps tree.
>
> What I now do is always update my data in Ancestry then
> export from Ancestry to Gramps, and each time I do this I
> create a new tree in Gramps.  If I get any images etc.
> through Ancestry I also save them to a folder on my PC so
> that if ever I cancel my Ancestry membership or something
> happens to their servers I still have the source data.
>
> The Ancestry site does not store addresses very well. They
> just get stored as a single text string.  When you import
> the GEDCOM into Gramps this address string is put into the
> Place Name field, leaving all the others empty.  That field
> isn't currently one of the ones referenced by the Gramps
> Place Completion Tool, so at the moment if you work in the
> way I have suggested you will lose the ability to query or
> run Gramps reports based on location unless you are prepared
> to do a lot of manual "tidying".
>
> This is just my way of working, and it might not suit you,
> but I hope the above is of some help.
>
> Lorna.
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: *Ted Lomatski* <[hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>>
> Date: 22 March 2012 22:18
> Subject: Re: [Gramps-users] Collaborative family research
> To: Eckhard Genßmann <[hidden email]
> <mailto:[hidden email]>>
> Cc: [hidden email]
> <mailto:[hidden email]>
>
>
> Good day Eckhard,
>
> I fully sympathise with you and the frustration you must
> feel at getting your relatives to contriubute.
>
> I made a big breakthrough when we celebrated my mother's
> 80th birthday.  We rented a banquet hall (during February -
> cold here in Canada, so cheap rent and food), printed out
> both sides of the family each in a 2.5 metre chart and I
> blew up 12 pictures from the early 1900s which we also put
> up on the wall.  I got a great response and had two aunts
> volunteer to help.
>
> As for collaboration on line, when I uploaded my file, the
> people that asked to "help" I received no help and found
> that the information was shared with others.  I knew this
> because there were errors in the file that I was well aware of.
>
> If you are looking for a site, there is
> http://www.ancestry.com with a German site at
> http://www.ancestry.de/
>
> As for keeping control of your database, once you put it out
> there, that's it.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Ted
>
>
> On 22 March 2012 17:28, Eckhard Genßmann
> <[hidden email]
> <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>
>     Hi all,____
>
>     I’m using gramps form my private family research since
>     some years and I’m really happy with it. However, as
>     there are few members of my family interested in
>     contributing to the research, I’m considering to change
>     to an environment on web to allow collaboration with
>     others.____
>
>     I’m thinking on PhpGedView (but this looks very
>     outdated) or Webtrees <http://webtrees.net/> or
>     something similar.____
>
>     Nevertheless, I would like to maintain ownership of the
>     data.  Ideally I could monitor what others are adding
>     and then decide to accept this contribution or leave it
>     with the person who added…____
>
>     __ __
>
>     Is there any experience with that kind of collaboration?
>     How are you handling this? Does it make sense to
>     completely switch to the other tool or how could this
>     work together with Gramps?____
>
>     What happened with the Gramps project that was started
>     some time ago to develop an online-version?____
>
>     __ __
>
>     Many thanks,____
>
>     Eckhard____
>
>     __ __
>
>     __ __
>
>
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>
>
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>
>
>
>
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>
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Re: Collaborative family research

avarnes
In reply to this post by Eckhard Genßmann
If you're looking for web/php based software like webtrees for the purpose of collaboration, please check out HuMo-gen. It supports permissions per user group, in addition to the basic functionality you would expect from standalone software (including in-place editing, multiple trees, duplicate search/merge, gedcom export, etc.).
Even better, it is free/open source and has a very active development team who will implement any (good) suggestion you throw at them.
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Re: Collaborative family research

jerome
Not tested all of them, but there are many others 'foss/floss' tools in many languages (coding):

* http://gramps-project.org/wiki/index.php?title=Other_genealogy_tools#Other_Tools

* http://gramps-project.org/wiki/index.php?title=Other_genealogy_software

All have advantages and disadvantages.
About synchronization and exchange, some of them have inherited gedcom limits, some others have features limitations.


--- En date de : Ven 23.3.12, avarnes <[hidden email]> a écrit :

> De: avarnes <[hidden email]>
> Objet: Re: [Gramps-users] Collaborative family research
> À: [hidden email]
> Date: Vendredi 23 mars 2012, 20h33
> If you're looking for web/php based
> software like webtrees for the purpose of
> collaboration, please check out HuMo-gen. It supports
> permissions per user
> group, in addition to the basic functionality you would
> expect from
> standalone software (including in-place editing, multiple
> trees, duplicate
> search/merge, gedcom export, etc.).
> Even better, it is free/open source and has a very active
> development team
> who will implement any (good) suggestion you throw at them.
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://gramps.1791082.n4.nabble.com/Collaborative-family-research-tp4496764p4499974.html
> Sent from the GRAMPS - User mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
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>

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Re: Collaborative family research

benste
In reply to this post by Eckhard Genßmann
I had a similar problem and did not wish to put my Gramps database directly online. I incorporated Gramps within my Joomla site (within a registered user section) but also put a Blog page there to encourage feedback, which I could assess and then add to the family tree.

Ben Steven
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Re: Collaborative family research

Eckhard Genßmann
In reply to this post by LornaJ

Thanks for all the comments received on this question.

It looks like I would lose some information when moving to an online solution. To make it even worse: you don’t know what you are about to lose. The majority of the responses to that question also made clear that there is NOT that big benefit that the online collaboration will bring – but a lot of concerns and effort to synchronize.

 

My decision based on your comments: I will wait and see what Gramps Connect will bring once it is ready for use. In the meantime, I will do the traditional way: offer my information to the family through Navweb and ask for comments and corrections by email, that I can work into my Gramps data …

 

Again, thanks a lot for your contributions. It helped to build my mind and to avoid bad decision.

Eckhard

 

Von: b4m [mailto:[hidden email]]
Gesendet: Freitag, 23. März 2012 01:27
An: [hidden email]
Betreff: [Gramps-users] Collaborative family research

 

Further to Ted's reply below,

 

I also use Ancestry as my main on-line tool.  Other people cannot change your tree there (so they can't break it for you!), but they can add comments if you allow them to, and if they have their own tree you can accept "Hints" from their tree and copy information fairly easily from one tree to another. Of course, if you make your tree public, or even have it as a private one shared only with your family members, the information you have in your tree is likely to be shared with others.  Ancestry does however have a setting which hides the details of living people in your tree from others, to protect their privacy.

 

The main difficulty I have found with keeping an online tree on Ancestry and a local one in Gramps is that of keeping them both in sync.

 

Unfortunately the GEDCOM file which is created from Ancestry does not contain all the information which you might have saved to your online tree (for instance you will lose any images or attached stories), and there is a similar issue if you try to import a GEDCOM into Ancestry which was created by your Gramps tree.

 

What I now do is always update my data in Ancestry then export from Ancestry to Gramps, and each time I do this I create a new tree in Gramps.  If I get any images etc. through Ancestry I also save them to a folder on my PC so that if ever I cancel my Ancestry membership or something happens to their servers I still have the source data.

 

The Ancestry site does not store addresses very well. They just get stored as a single text string.  When you import the GEDCOM into Gramps this address string is put into the Place Name field, leaving all the others empty.  That field isn't currently one of the ones referenced by the Gramps Place Completion Tool, so at the moment if you work in the way I have suggested you will lose the ability to query or run Gramps reports based on location unless you are prepared to do a lot of manual "tidying".

 

This is just my way of working, and it might not suit you, but I hope the above is of some help.

 

Lorna.

 

 

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Ted Lomatski <[hidden email]>
Date: 22 March 2012 22:18
Subject: Re: [Gramps-users] Collaborative family research
To: Eckhard Genßmann <[hidden email]>
Cc: [hidden email]


Good day Eckhard,

I fully sympathise with you and the frustration you must feel at getting your relatives to contriubute. 

I made a big breakthrough when we celebrated my mother's 80th birthday.  We rented a banquet hall (during February - cold here in Canada, so cheap rent and food), printed out both sides of the family each in a 2.5 metre chart and I blew up 12 pictures from the early 1900s which we also put up on the wall.  I got a great response and had two aunts volunteer to help.

As for collaboration on line, when I uploaded my file, the people that asked to "help" I received no help and found that the information was shared with others.  I knew this because there were errors in the file that I was well aware of.

If you are looking for a site, there is http://www.ancestry.com with a German site at http://www.ancestry.de/

As for keeping control of your database, once you put it out there, that's it.

Cheers,

Ted

On 22 March 2012 17:28, Eckhard Genßmann <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hi all,

I’m using gramps form my private family research since some years and I’m really happy with it. However, as there are few members of my family interested in contributing to the research, I’m considering to change to an environment on web to allow collaboration with others.

I’m thinking on PhpGedView (but this looks very outdated) or Webtrees or something similar.

Nevertheless, I would like to maintain ownership of the data.  Ideally I could monitor what others are adding and then decide to accept this contribution or leave it with the person who added…

 

Is there any experience with that kind of collaboration? How are you handling this? Does it make sense to completely switch to the other tool or how could this work together with Gramps?

What happened with the Gramps project that was started some time ago to develop an online-version?

 

Many thanks,

Eckhard

 

 

 

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Re: Collaborative family research

Eckhard Genßmann
In reply to this post by benste
Hi Ben,

I just dropped another question to the user list asking for the integration
of the Navweb pages into Joomla.
I'm using joomla 2.5.3 and I googled may hours for a way to integrate.

Would you please share how you did?
>From what I learned so far: you could add a sub-folder in the joomly media
folder. You could grant all kinds of editor or authoring rights to that
folder - but I could not find a way to restrict (read-)access to that folder
for a defined user group - similar as you can do with other joomla articles.
Restricting just the menu is not good enough as one could enter the url
directly into the browser ...

Many thanks,
Eckhard

-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: benste [mailto:[hidden email]]
Gesendet: Montag, 26. März 2012 12:13
An: [hidden email]
Betreff: Re: [Gramps-users] Collaborative family research

I had a similar problem and did not wish to put my Gramps database directly
online. I incorporated Gramps within my Joomla site (within a registered
user section) but also put a Blog page there to encourage feedback, which I
could assess and then add to the family tree.

Ben Steven

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