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Event for Y-DNA data

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Event for Y-DNA data

john f jarvis
Is there an event to be used for storing the allele values of the
increasingly used tests in genealogical research. A scan of the event
types in 3.0.2 didn't show a likely candidate.
        Thanks, John Jarvis


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Re: Event for Y-DNA data

Doug Morrison-Cleary
On Wed, 22 Oct 2008 16:35:34 -0400
john f jarvis <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Is there an event to be used for storing the allele values of the
> increasingly used tests in genealogical research. A scan of the event
> types in 3.0.2 didn't show a likely candidate.
> Thanks, John Jarvis
>
>
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I would suggest recording this data, for now, as an Attribute (onthe
person) rather than as an event. Whether each allele should be a
separate atttribute is up to you. At some point we need a better system
for handling this data, but it may look similar to the standard
attribute because that's the type of data it is and it needs to remain
flexible as more alleles are added to the tests.

Hope this makes sense.

Doug

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Re: Event for Y-DNA data

Benny Malengier
A page was started a while back on genetics in the wiki:
http://www.gramps-project.org/wiki/index.php?title=Genetics

The idea was to next list ways to store this info in GRAMPS, so as to be able to identify possible bottlenecks and hence improvements that are needed to better store this data.

So, if you start using GRAMPS with genetics, keep us informed and update the wiki page with sections 'Storing it with GRAMPS'

About your question, events is something happening to a person, your DNA does not really happen to you (taking the test could be an event though). So an attribute looks indeed better suited.

Eg an attribute DYS389I  with the repeats as value.
If you want to store values with multiple keys, use a fixed syntax, eg (Haplo G, DYS389I), and value the repeat.

One could then extract data from GRAMPS based on this.

Benny

2008/10/23 Doug Morrison-Cleary <[hidden email]>
On Wed, 22 Oct 2008 16:35:34 -0400
john f jarvis <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Is there an event to be used for storing the allele values of the
> increasingly used tests in genealogical research. A scan of the event
> types in 3.0.2 didn't show a likely candidate.
>       Thanks, John Jarvis
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's
> challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK
> & win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source
> event anywhere in the world
> http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100&url=/
> _______________________________________________ Gramps-users mailing
> list [hidden email]
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gramps-users

I would suggest recording this data, for now, as an Attribute (onthe
person) rather than as an event. Whether each allele should be a
separate atttribute is up to you. At some point we need a better system
for handling this data, but it may look similar to the standard
attribute because that's the type of data it is and it needs to remain
flexible as more alleles are added to the tests.

Hope this makes sense.

Doug

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Re: Event for Y-DNA data

john f jarvis
I accept the distinction between event and attribute.

The DNA testing services (at least FamilyTreeDNA that I have used) make
available matching services. The primary purpose of DNA testing appears
to be linking two different family trees rather than resolving questions
within a single tree. Questions of parentage such as undisclosed
adoptions would be an exception. My interest in storing the DNA test
results is for long term archival. I expect others in the family younger
than I will eventually inherit this task.

The DNA test results should be stored in a self defining way such as
DYS393=13. Using a scheme like this for a 37 marker test results in a
string of about 400 characters which is too much too long for the
present GRAMPS attribute format. 67 marker tests are in use and longer
ones appear likely. Currently a simple note appears to be the best
choice for the way to attach this data to a particular person.

Use of multiple attributes, one for each marker is simply too tedious.

I'd be interested in others experiences with the use of genetics in
genealogy.
        John

On Thu, 2008-10-23 at 15:14 +0200, Benny Malengier wrote:

> A page was started a while back on genetics in the wiki:
> http://www.gramps-project.org/wiki/index.php?title=Genetics
>
> The idea was to next list ways to store this info in GRAMPS, so as to
> be able to identify possible bottlenecks and hence improvements that
> are needed to better store this data.
>
> So, if you start using GRAMPS with genetics, keep us informed and
> update the wiki page with sections 'Storing it with GRAMPS'
>
> About your question, events is something happening to a person, your
> DNA does not really happen to you (taking the test could be an event
> though). So an attribute looks indeed better suited.
>
> Eg an attribute DYS389I  with the repeats as value.
> If you want to store values with multiple keys, use a fixed syntax, eg
> (Haplo G, DYS389I), and value the repeat.
>
> One could then extract data from GRAMPS based on this.
>
> Benny
>
> 2008/10/23 Doug Morrison-Cleary <[hidden email]>
>        
>         On Wed, 22 Oct 2008 16:35:34 -0400
>         john f jarvis <[hidden email]> wrote:
>        
>         > Is there an event to be used for storing the allele values
>         of the
>         > increasingly used tests in genealogical research. A scan of
>         the event
>         > types in 3.0.2 didn't show a likely candidate.
>         >       Thanks, John Jarvis
>         >
>         >
>         >
>         -------------------------------------------------------------------------
>         > This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move
>         Developer's
>         > challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with
>         Moblin SDK
>         > & win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open
>         Source
>         > event anywhere in the world
>         > http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100&url=/
>         > _______________________________________________ Gramps-users
>         mailing
>         > list [hidden email]
>         > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gramps-users
>        
>        
>         I would suggest recording this data, for now, as an Attribute
>         (onthe
>         person) rather than as an event. Whether each allele should be
>         a
>         separate atttribute is up to you. At some point we need a
>         better system
>         for handling this data, but it may look similar to the
>         standard
>         attribute because that's the type of data it is and it needs
>         to remain
>         flexible as more alleles are added to the tests.
>        
>         Hope this makes sense.
>        
>         Doug
>        
>        
>         -------------------------------------------------------------------------
>         This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move
>         Developer's challenge
>         Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK &
>         win great prizes
>         Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere
>         in the world
>         http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100&url=/
>         _______________________________________________
>         Gramps-users mailing list
>         [hidden email]
>         https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gramps-users
>        
>


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Re: Event for Y-DNA data

N James Bridge
On Fri, 2008-10-24 at 09:57 -0400, john f jarvis wrote:
> I accept the distinction between event and attribute.
>
> The DNA testing services (at least FamilyTreeDNA that I have used) make
> available matching services. The primary purpose of DNA testing appears
> to be linking two different family trees rather than resolving questions
> within a single tree. Questions of parentage such as undisclosed
> adoptions would be an exception. My interest in storing the DNA test
> results is for long term archival. I expect others in the family younger
> than I will eventually inherit this

This is probably not a good idea, since the various companies follow
slightly different schemes, not out of perversity but simply because of
the lack of standards in a rapidly developing field. I know that SMGF
modified their numbering for certain markers about a year ago(?) and
Genebase have just done so, to come into line with the NIST guidelines,
where these exist. Each company automatically updates its own database
but data stored in an independent system will go out of date and it
would not be at all easy for a non-specialist to unravel at a later
date. SMGF have a "conversion table" on their website which shows that
for many markers, the conversions between different lab standards are
still unknown, or at least not made public.
--
N. James Bridge <[hidden email]>


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