Fwd: Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

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Fwd: Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

enno
Hi Matthias,
 
> I believe the font size in Josip's last version is correct, at least under Win7. (I actually tried 8pt and found it to be too small.)
 
True. In my Windows 8.1 the default font size in menus is 9, and 11 for window. All configurable, maybe in Windows 7 too.
 
> (b) Windows 7 (Firefox) and Gramps 4.0.3-4 use the new Windows Font "Segoe", which is also marginally wider (but not higher), in contrast to Gramps 3.4.7
 
This is weird, because if this is true, the fonts in the menus and view buttons in Gramps 4.0.3 would be the same as in the menu bar of Firefox, and they don’t look the same to me. Moreover, my old complaint still exists. If you zoom in on the picture, you will see lots of shadows in the font of Schaubilder, way more than in Vorfahren.
 
To test this further, I downloaded Helge’s version again. His 4.0.3 is not there, so I had to use his 4.0.2 zip for this test. I modified the settings.ini for both, commenting out all lines except the warp, so that Gtk+ can use defaults for font and theme. And with those same settings, our latest 4.0.3 does still look bad.

https://plus.google.com/photos/112837147771804703405/albums/5979863952880912161?authkey=CL3c6qKVwbePRw
 
The screenshots are on Google now, to avoid large attachments on the list, and when you compare them, you will see that the ID’s in the EXE (4.0.3) seem to be half bold. Most digits look that way, but not all, and that’s the fuzzy look that I mentioned earlier. You have to zoom to 100 % to see this right, because otherwise the zoom will affect what you see.
 
To see more differences, you can load both pictures in Paint, and zoom in a couple of times. When you do that, you can see that the horizontal and vertical lines of the fonts in 4.0.2 zip are razor sharp. You see grey pixels in curves, which are made on purpose, i.e. anti-aliasing. In the 4.0.3 exe you will see that vertical lines in fonts have grey shadows everywhere! In the ID’s, you can even see that some digits are so fuzzy that they seem to connect.
 
My conclusion is that in the EXE version fonts are misaligned. They are not as pixel perfect as they can be with Gtk+ 3.0, like the ZIP version shows.
 
regards,
 
Enno


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Re: Fwd: Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

Tim Lyons
Administrator
Just trying to be helpful commenting on the examples posted by others.


I think that providing some means for the user to change the font etc. is way too complicated for the user for us to offer.


I think it is clear that the font size is not a problem. I am convinced by all the examples that the font size is the same in all the examples.

The spacing and overall width is different in different examples. For example in gramps_fontsize_comparison2.png the width of the font of Schaubilder, is more than in Vorfahren. However, this is such a small difference that (all other things being equal) it is not worth doing anything about (even though it does slightly reduce the amount of information in any given space).
 

I agree with Enno, that some of the examples look much more smudged than others. For example, in gramps_fontsize_comparison2.png the font of Schaubilder has smudged vertical lines, way more than in Vorfahren. Similarly, in Enno's
https://plus.google.com/photos/112837147771804703405/albums/5979863952880912161?authkey=CL3c6qKVwbePRw screenshots, 403 is more smudged than 402. The Firefox display also looks smudged.

From Matthias' discussion, it appears that the cause of the smudging is:
(1) a change of font (e.g. from MS Sans Serif to Segoe) or
(2) a difference in the quality of the rendering of the font(s) or
(3) both.

The change in overall width is probably due to a change in font. As I say, on its own it is probably not worth doing anything about.

The smudging is probably due to a change in font, possibly exacerbated by poor rendering. The Segoe wikipedia page says:

"Segoe UI is optimized for Vista's default ClearType rendering environment, and it is significantly less legible when ClearType is disabled, except at key user interface sizes (8, 9 and 10 point) where Segoe UI has been hinted for bi-level rendering. The standard font size increased to 9 pt. in Windows Vista to accommodate for better layout and readability for all languages."

[As I say, the last sentence about change in font size is not relevant, because it seems clear that the font size is not different in the numerous examples supplied].

Do the various font rendering libraries we call use "Vista's default ClearType rendering environment"? Do the libraries use 'bi-level rendering"?

If not (and I expect they don't, and possibly Firefox doesn't either), then perhaps we need to change the Windows installation to force use of MS Sans Serif in Windows, since we are not able to provide a clear font otherwise.

It would be interesting to see the rendering of some text in Windows Vista using the defaults (e.g. the rendering of some Windows control panel assuming that uses the defaults).

Tim.


 
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Re: Fwd: Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

enno
Tim,
> Just trying to be helpful commenting on the examples posted by others.
Thanks. I did some extra tests today, and read through a lot of traffic
on the RootsDev mailing list, but it looks like I have some extra
understanding now.
> I think that providing some means for the user to change the font etc. is
> way too complicated for the user for us to offer.
Right. We can put some instructions on the wiki, when we get questions
about this, but I see no role for tools right now.

> I agree with Enno, that some of the examples look much more smudged than
> others. For example, in gramps_fontsize_comparison2.png the font of
> Schaubilder has smudged vertical lines, way more than in Vorfahren.
> Similarly, in Enno's
> https://plus.google.com/photos/112837147771804703405/albums/5979863952880912161?authkey=CL3c6qKVwbePRw
> screenshots, 403 is more smudged than 402. The Firefox display also looks
> smudged.
>
> >From Matthias' discussion, it appears that the cause of the smudging is:
> (1) a change of font (e.g. from MS Sans Serif to Segoe) or
> (2) a difference in the quality of the rendering of the font(s) or
> (3) both.
In my test, which I repeated tonight with Josip's 4.0.2, I tried to rule
out 1 by removing all font and style lines from settings.ini, so that
Gtk would use the default font, which I assumed was tested best by its
developers on all sorts of platforms. And from the looks I'd say that
fonts are indeed the same.

This leads me to the conclusion that there is a difference in rendering
between the tools packed by Helge and Josip, which may be revealed by
running gramps -v. I don't have the energy for that right now, but I
hope that Helge and Josip can help us here.

> The change in overall width is probably due to a change in font. As I say,
> on its own it is probably not worth doing anything about.
>
> The smudging is probably due to a change in font, possibly exacerbated by
> poor rendering. The Segoe wikipedia page says:
>
> "Segoe UI is optimized for Vista's default ClearType rendering environment,
> and it is significantly less legible when ClearType is disabled, except at
> key user interface sizes (8, 9 and 10 point) where Segoe UI has been hinted
> for bi-level rendering. The standard font size increased to 9 pt. in Windows
> Vista to accommodate for better layout and readability for all languages."
>
> [As I say, the last sentence about change in font size is not relevant,
> because it seems clear that the font size is not different in the numerous
> examples supplied].
>
> Do the various font rendering libraries we call use "Vista's default
> ClearType rendering environment"? Do the libraries use 'bi-level rendering"?
The weird part here is that I would expect that the rendering would be
done by the OS, which is Windows 8.1, and not be influenced by Gtk or
any other tool, but it looks like I am wrong. This probably explains why
I found complaints on Linux forums too, and why Mathias' Firefox is
smudged too.
> If not (and I expect they don't, and possibly Firefox doesn't either), then
> perhaps we need to change the Windows installation to force use of MS Sans
> Serif in Windows, since we are not able to provide a clear font otherwise.
I read earlier that Sans Serif was discarded in 4.0 because of
complaints from users using Asian fonts. The suggestion is good however,
and I noticed that Tahoma 9 works nice on Windows 8.1. Enlarged
screenshots show no smudging at all on either version. This is probably
because Tahoma was initially designed as a bitmap font. It is default in
XP, and there is a Wine version too, which also looks OK when I install
Josip's AIO in that.
> It would be interesting to see the rendering of some text in Windows Vista
> using the defaults (e.g. the rendering of some Windows control panel
> assuming that uses the defaults).
Indeed, but I doubt if we have anyone that runs Vista on this list.

regards,

Enno


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Re: Fwd: Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

Helge.Herz-2
Am 14.02.2014 00:32, schrieb Enno Borgsteede:
> This leads me to the conclusion that there is a difference in rendering
> between the tools packed by Helge and Josip, which may be revealed by
> running gramps -v. I don't have the energy for that right now, but I
> hope that Helge and Josip can help us here.
It's quit correct, my package was  based on a different gtk build and
did use also some different parts than Josip's installer.  You know I
did remove it for 4.0.3 to have one common Win solution only now.

BTW: May be I'm totally wrong, but I don't understand the trials to find
the best font and font size for any related Win version to go ahead.
Going this way: How to handle individual Win settings e.g. for users
having wrong eyes or a small tablet or what ever?

For my opinion there are two good solutions only:
(1) Gtk /or Gramps will be able to look for the current Win settings and
uses simple the same. That's what a standard user would expect. (Because
nobody did suggest this, I assume that's currently not possible.)
(2) At least for Win we provide the user the possibility to use it's own
choice for theme, font and font size: Gramps contains a setting page or
(not so good) we have a separate tool to do that. I think there is
already a feature request available.

As result I would like to please some one how is able to do this to
force a solution for (2). I'm very sorry, but it's behind my
possibilities to do that.
- Helge


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Re: Fwd: Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

enno
Helge,
> Am 14.02.2014 00:32, schrieb Enno Borgsteede:
>> This leads me to the conclusion that there is a difference in rendering
>> between the tools packed by Helge and Josip, which may be revealed by
>> running gramps -v. I don't have the energy for that right now, but I
>> hope that Helge and Josip can help us here.
> It's quit correct, my package was  based on a different gtk build and
> did use also some different parts than Josip's installer.  You know I
> did remove it for 4.0.3 to have one common Win solution only now.
I know, and I just checked GTK versions in Windows 8.1, and to my
surprise the GTK+ in Josip's 4.0.3 is newer than the one you packed in
the 4.0.2 zip, and it still gives smudged fonts. How can that be? I
hoped it was different, and Josip's 4.0.2 GTK version was older, but the
smudging is the same.
> BTW: May be I'm totally wrong, but I don't understand the trials to find
> the best font and font size for any related Win version to go ahead.
> Going this way: How to handle individual Win settings e.g. for users
> having wrong eyes or a small tablet or what ever?
Well, that's because the default was not nice, and the majority of users
will leave Windows at default settings I assume.
> For my opinion there are two good solutions only:
> (1) Gtk /or Gramps will be able to look for the current Win settings and
> uses simple the same. That's what a standard user would expect. (Because
> nobody did suggest this, I assume that's currently not possible.)
Not possible is a strong term, but I haven't seen any GTK functions to
read Win settings, so when it's done, it must probably be a native
Windows application.
> (2) At least for Win we provide the user the possibility to use it's own
> choice for theme, font and font size: Gramps contains a setting page or
> (not so good) we have a separate tool to do that. I think there is
> already a feature request available.
>
> As result I would like to please some one how is able to do this to
> force a solution for (2). I'm very sorry, but it's behind my
> possibilities to do that.
I think that there is a patch in the feature request, but the complaint
was that it didn't work. Anyway, at the moment I don't care, because I
haven't seen many user requests for this.

sorry,

Enno


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Re: Fwd: Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

Tim Lyons
Administrator
enno wrote
Helge,
> Am 14.02.2014 00:32, schrieb Enno Borgsteede:
> BTW: May be I'm totally wrong, but I don't understand the trials to find
> the best font and font size for any related Win version to go ahead.
> Going this way: How to handle individual Win settings e.g. for users
> having wrong eyes or a small tablet or what ever?
Well, that's because the default was not nice, and the majority of users
will leave Windows at default settings I assume.
I agree. I also agree with Enno's point "Right. We can put some instructions on the wiki, when we get questions about this, but I see no role for tools right now."

I think the point is to try to debug the problem.

If Gramps is just using the defaults for Windows/GTK/etc. and the problem lies outside Gramps (and that seems to be the case) then we actively must NOT try to fix the problem in Gramps. We should not change the font specially for Gramps (I know I said something different before, but I am persuaded by the arguments).

What we should be doing is reporting the problem to the right place which is probably GTK for not using the most advanced font rendering technology.




BTW Enno, "Gtk would use the default font, which I assumed was tested best by its developers on all sorts of platforms"  that is a very optimistic expectation!

"I would expect that the rendering would be done by the OS, which is Windows 8.1, and not be influenced by Gtk or any other tool": I expect not, because GTK is probably trying to be multi-platform, and hence remove dependencies on the underlying OS.

Note, if you use the adage "follow the money", then you are drawn to the conclusion that Microsoft would tend to make it hard for other software developers to produce the best rendered text for third-party apps, so that users are drawn to the Microsoft alternatives instead.

Tim.

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Re: Fwd: Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

enno
Tim,
> "I would expect that the rendering would be done by the OS, which is
> Windows 8.1, and not be influenced by Gtk or any other tool": I expect
> not, because GTK is probably trying to be multi-platform, and hence
> remove dependencies on the underlying OS.
Good one. I tried to figure that out, and it looks like there are
multiple ways, one of which is let Pango use win32 font rendering as
provided by the Windows API, and others are built-in, like Cairo. That's
after some quick reading on the GTK site, but it sounds logical.
> Note, if you use the adage "follow the money", then you are drawn to
> the conclusion that Microsoft would tend to make it hard for other
> software developers to produce the best rendered text for third-party
> apps, so that users are drawn to the Microsoft alternatives instead.
There were rumours about that from the time of browser wars (Netscape
age), but I can't imagine such things in the field of genealogy.
Microsoft wants developers to write software, and they don't have such a
program of their own, so in this case, they would only hurt themselves.
That's also why they provide free versions of Visual Studio, etc. They
know people can use NetBeans, etc., from their biggest competitor on the
server market, Oracle, so ...

regards,

Enno

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Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

John Ralls-2

On Feb 14, 2014, at 2:20 PM, enno <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Tim,
> > "I would expect that the rendering would be done by the OS, which is
> > Windows 8.1, and not be influenced by Gtk or any other tool": I expect
> > not, because GTK is probably trying to be multi-platform, and hence
> > remove dependencies on the underlying OS.
> Good one. I tried to figure that out, and it looks like there are
> multiple ways, one of which is let Pango use win32 font rendering as
> provided by the Windows API, and others are built-in, like Cairo. That's
> after some quick reading on the GTK site, but it sounds logical.
> > Note, if you use the adage "follow the money", then you are drawn to
> > the conclusion that Microsoft would tend to make it hard for other
> > software developers to produce the best rendered text for third-party
> > apps, so that users are drawn to the Microsoft alternatives instead.
> There were rumours about that from the time of browser wars (Netscape
> age), but I can't imagine such things in the field of genealogy.
> Microsoft wants developers to write software, and they don't have such a
> program of their own, so in this case, they would only hurt themselves.
> That's also why they provide free versions of Visual Studio, etc. They
> know people can use NetBeans, etc., from their biggest competitor on the
> server market, Oracle, so ...

There really is only Pango if you’re using stock controls as we do, but there’s more than one way to configure Pango for Windows, and that might have something to do with it. There might also be an issue with high-dpi displays, particularly on newer laptops.

Regards,
John Ralls


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Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

Josip

>
> There really is only Pango if you’re using stock controls as we do, but there’s more than one way to configure Pango for Windows, and that might have something to do with it. There might also be an issue with high-dpi displays, particularly on newer laptops.
>
> Regards,
> John Ralls
>

Yes this is a high-DPI problem or as known on Windows a DPI-Awareness
and VirtualResolution issue.

There is three possible situations:
1. program without declared DPI-Awareness
2. program with declared DPI-Awareness = False
3. program with declared DPI-Awareness = True (or "True/PM")

VirtualResolutin for supporting of high dpi displays started with Vista
and get changed in every new Windows version.

All previous AIO-4.3.0 is type "1" so text is rendered at native
resolution and stretched to virtual one (worst case, text look like
bristly cat).
   AIO-3.4.7 looks like type "2" text is smudged but small inaf to just
appear as bold (i will not use that). GUI use "classic theme" not
"modern theme" because it is linked against Common Control library
(ComCtl32.dll) v.5 and not v.6 ("Clearlooks" and other good-looking
theme had problems on Windows so native one is used)
   AIO-4.0.3-4 is type "3" and only in that text in gui is rendered same
way as text in window title (window title is non-client area).
He also use "modern theme" style plus few other things as mentioned on:
https://gramps-project.org/wiki/index.php?title=GrampsAIO-4


John please put AIO-4.0.3-4 on SF,
or remove previously one!

--
Josip

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Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

John Ralls-2

On Feb 14, 2014, at 11:22 PM, Josip <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
> John please put AIO-4.0.3-4 on SF,
> or remove previously one!

Done.

Sorry I missed the link when it was posted.

Regards,
John Ralls


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Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

enno
Devs,

It's still the same. Look at the font in the about box:

https://plus.google.com/photos/112837147771804703405/albums/5979863952880912161?authkey=CL3c6qKVwbePRw

Tested in Dutch Windows 8.1, full HD. DPI makes no difference.

regards,

Enno


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Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

Josip
Dana 15.2.2014. 16:33, Enno Borgsteede je napisao:

> Devs,
>
> It's still the same. Look at the font in the about box:
>
> https://plus.google.com/photos/112837147771804703405/albums/5979863952880912161?authkey=CL3c6qKVwbePRw
>
>
> Tested in Dutch Windows 8.1, full HD. DPI makes no difference.
>
> regards,
>
> Enno
>

Windows 8.1
15.6 inch display, 16:9 format, 1920x1080px, 141dpi (Which is by default
scaled at 125%)

--
Josip

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Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

enno
Hi Josip,
> Windows 8.1 15.6 inch display, 16:9 format, 1920x1080px, 141dpi (Which
> is by default scaled at 125%)
OK. Mine is 1920x1080 on 24 ", or 1366x768 on 15.6 ", that's both about
100 dpi, and suggests that we're comparing apples and pears.

Smudged fonts on both, which makes 4.0.3 on my laptop just as bad as on
my desktop pc, and not ready to be promoted on the download page.

So then, what's causing Helge's 4.0.2 version to be razor sharp? I don't
know, but I feel like you need to exchange some details about this.

regards,

Enno


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Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

Josip
Dana 15.2.2014. 20:00, Enno Borgsteede je napisao:

> Hi Josip,
>> Windows 8.1 15.6 inch display, 16:9 format, 1920x1080px, 141dpi (Which
>> is by default scaled at 125%)
> OK. Mine is 1920x1080 on 24 ", or 1366x768 on 15.6 ", that's both about
> 100 dpi, and suggests that we're comparing apples and pears.
>
> Smudged fonts on both, which makes 4.0.3 on my laptop just as bad as on
> my desktop pc, and not ready to be promoted on the download page.
>
> So then, what's causing Helge's 4.0.2 version to be razor sharp? I don't
> know, but I feel like you need to exchange some details about this.
>
> regards,
>
> Enno
>

Yes we do compare apples and pears :-)

Try to change GrampsAIO-4.0.3\etc\gtk-3.0\settings.ini to this:

############settings.ini##################
[Settings]
gtk-icon-theme-name = gnome
gtk-primary-button-warps-slider = false
gtk-xft-antialias = 1
#Resolution for Xft, in 1024 * dots/inch. -1 to use default value.
#72DPI = 73728
#96DPI = 98304
#128DPI = 131072
gtk-xft-dpi = 98304
#Hint Xft fonts; 0=no, 1=yes, -1=default.
gtk-xft-hinting = 1
#Hinting: hintnone, hintslight, hintmedium, or hintfull
gtk-xft-hintstyle = hintfull
#Subpixel antialiasing; none, rgb, bgr, vrgb, vbgr.
gtk-xft-rgba = rgb
######################################

How to make those changes at install/run times???

--
Josip

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Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

Josip
Dana 16.2.2014. 14:31, Enno Borgsteede je napisao:

> Hi Josip,
>
>> Yes we do compare apples and pears :-)
>> Try to change GrampsAIO-4.0.3\etc\gtk-3.0\settings.ini to this:
>
> ############settings.ini##################
> [Settings]
> gtk-icon-theme-name = gnome
> gtk-primary-button-warps-slider = false
> gtk-xft-antialias = 1
> #Resolution for Xft, in 1024 * dots/inch. -1 to use default value.
> #72DPI = 73728
> #96DPI = 98304
> #128DPI = 131072
> gtk-xft-dpi = 98304
> #Hint Xft fonts; 0=no, 1=yes, -1=default.
> gtk-xft-hinting = 1
> #Hinting: hintnone, hintslight, hintmedium, or hintfull
> gtk-xft-hintstyle = hintfull
> #Subpixel antialiasing; none, rgb, bgr, vrgb, vbgr.
> gtk-xft-rgba = rgb
> ######################################
>
> Yes, that works for me. It looks as sharp as Helge's version. On zooming
> in in Paint, I see shadows in all fonts, in colour, which is logical,
> because you set anti-aliasing to RGB.
>
>> How to make those changes at install/run times???
>
> That's difficult. I'm sure that there are Windows API calls that you can
> use to query the DPI of the display device, but in a way that is
> rediculous. Helge's version displays ok without shadows right away, and
> your GTK, Pango, and Cairo are the same as his, or even newer. Not the
> shadows matter much, because you don't see them unless you zoom in with
> Paint, but for me it's a principle. When you need to tune the ini file
> to my display resolution, it looks like something's terribly wrong
> somewhere.
>
> I have to go now, but I just found that it also works to use the -1 for
> the resolution here. And that means that you don't need to tune the ini
> file at all.
>
> thanks,
>
> Enno
>

Helge's "Gramps403AIOpackageWin32pygi3.10.6V01" don't work for me.
At default "Normal" (125%) everything is blurred, at "Small" (100%) it
have also problems but most obvious with digits (like that are bolder
then letters but irregular shape)

Didn't quite understand your comment about shadow.
Is it with "gtk-xft-dpi = -1" everything acceptable or not?
We need something that works for all Windows users ;-)

--
Josip

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Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

Helge.Herz-2
In reply to this post by enno

Am 16.02.2014 13:47, schrieb Josip:
Yes we do compare apples and pears :-)

Try to change GrampsAIO-4.0.3\etc\gtk-3.0\settings.ini to this:

############settings.ini##################
[Settings]
gtk-icon-theme-name = gnome
gtk-primary-button-warps-slider = false
gtk-xft-antialias = 1
#Resolution for Xft, in 1024 * dots/inch. -1 to use default value.
#72DPI = 73728
#96DPI = 98304
#128DPI = 131072
gtk-xft-dpi = 98304
#Hint Xft fonts; 0=no, 1=yes, -1=default.
gtk-xft-hinting = 1
#Hinting: hintnone, hintslight, hintmedium, or hintfull
gtk-xft-hintstyle = hintfull
#Subpixel antialiasing; none, rgb, bgr, vrgb, vbgr.
gtk-xft-rgba = rgb
######################################

How to make those changes at install/run times???

Here are my results using the values above (looks good to me): https://www.dropbox.com/s/p1hxyjphmzvm0xm/Gramps_compare.jpg
All 4.0.3 done with Gramps based on Josips installer.
BTW: I didn't found a way for 4.0.3 to show the text below the icons in the menu bar

- Helge



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Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

Josip
Dana 16.2.2014. 18:41, Helge.Herz je napisao:

>
> Am 16.02.2014 13:47, schrieb Josip:
>> Yes we do compare apples and pears :-)
>>
>> Try to change GrampsAIO-4.0.3\etc\gtk-3.0\settings.ini to this:
>>
>> ############settings.ini##################
>> [Settings]
>> gtk-icon-theme-name = gnome
>> gtk-primary-button-warps-slider = false
>> gtk-xft-antialias = 1
>> #Resolution for Xft, in 1024 * dots/inch. -1 to use default value.
>> #72DPI = 73728
>> #96DPI = 98304
>> #128DPI = 131072
>> gtk-xft-dpi = 98304
>> #Hint Xft fonts; 0=no, 1=yes, -1=default.
>> gtk-xft-hinting = 1
>> #Hinting: hintnone, hintslight, hintmedium, or hintfull
>> gtk-xft-hintstyle = hintfull
>> #Subpixel antialiasing; none, rgb, bgr, vrgb, vbgr.
>> gtk-xft-rgba = rgb
>> ######################################
>>
>> How to make those changes at install/run times???
>>
> Here are my results using the values above (looks good to me):
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/p1hxyjphmzvm0xm/Gramps_compare.jpg
> All 4.0.3 done with Gramps based on Josips installer.
> BTW: I didn't found a way for 4.0.3 to show the text below the icons in
> the menu bar
>
> - Helge
>


Good to hear that.
But better if you post your display details (width X height @ DPI)

If you think of toolbar that is deprecated and ignored in 3.10
Use to work with "gtk-toolbar-style", see:
https://developer.gnome.org/gtk3/stable/GtkSettings.html#GtkSettings--gtk-toolbar-style

--
Josip

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Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

enno
In reply to this post by Josip
Hi Josip,

Helge's "Gramps403AIOpackageWin32pygi3.10.6V01" don't work for me.
At default "Normal" (125%) everything is blurred, at "Small" (100%) it have also problems but most obvious with digits (like that are bolder then letters but irregular shape)
So, with Helge's version your problems are like what I had with yours, and still have in 4.0.3-4 with standard settings.ini, bold digits, and smudge. And you probably have those because Helge's version has no anti-aliasing at all. 

Didn't quite understand your comment about shadow.
With shadow I mean that with extreme zoom in Paint, like 500 %, I see grey lines next to the black lines in fonts with vertical lines, like m. The difference with earlier situations though is that these grey lines are the same for every font, which means that anti-aliasing is working ok, and now, at 100 % there is no smudge at all.

Is it with "gtk-xft-dpi = -1" everything acceptable or not?
Yes. It was good on my desktop, and it's good on my laptop too.
 
We need something that works for all Windows users ;-)
Right. So, if -1 works for you too, with much higher DPI than I have, you can release 4.0.3-5 with -1, so that no tuning per user is needed.

thanks again,

Enno


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Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

Josip
Dana 16.2.2014. 20:44, Enno Borgsteede je napisao:

> Hi Josip,
>
>     Helge's "__Gramps403AIOpackageWin32pygi3.__10.6V01" don't work for me.
>     At default "Normal" (125%) everything is blurred, at "Small" (100%)
>     it have also problems but most obvious with digits (like that are
>     bolder then letters but irregular shape)
>
> So, with Helge's version your problems are like what I had with yours,
> and still have in 4.0.3-4 with standard settings.ini, bold digits, and
> smudge. And you probably have those because Helge's version has no
> anti-aliasing at all.
>
>
>     Didn't quite understand your comment about shadow.
>
> With shadow I mean that with extreme zoom in Paint, like 500 %, I see
> grey lines next to the black lines in fonts with vertical lines, like m.
> The difference with earlier situations though is that these grey lines
> are the same for every font, which means that anti-aliasing is working
> ok, and now, at 100 % there is no smudge at all.
>
>     Is it with "gtk-xft-dpi = -1" everything acceptable or not?
>
> Yes. It was good on my desktop, and it's good on my laptop too.
>
>     We need something that works for all Windows users ;-)
>
> Right. So, if -1 works for you too, with much higher DPI than I have,
> you can release 4.0.3-5 with -1, so that no tuning per user is needed.
>
> thanks again,
>
> Enno
>

Finally we solved it :-))

I do receive user request for more portable launchers which reside in
root folder of AIO install and not in AIO\bin folder.
Shall i do that prior to 4.0.3-5?
I can't upload to SF (don't have shell and release technician
permissions) so will have to bother someone to do that for me every time.

--
Josip

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Re: GrampsAIOBundle-4.0.3-4

enno
Hi Josip,
> I do receive user request for more portable launchers which reside in
> root folder of AIO install and not in AIO\bin folder.
> Shall i do that prior to 4.0.3-5?
I think not. Moving the launchers is one thing, but in a true portable
version, you need a portable database and settings too, and at the
moment I don't know how that's done. The Portable Gramps' author knows
more about this, and I bet that he will release his own 4.0.3 once we
declare this version as stable [1].

regards,

Enno

[1] http://portableapps.com/apps/education/gramps_portable




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