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Kidnapping event

Simon C. Tremblay
Hi everyone,

Turns out I have not one but three of my ancestors who were kidnapped in the Deerfiled, MA raid of February 29, 1704 and were then taken to Montreal, where they married and had many descendants.

To track that, I created a custom event type of Enlèvement (Kidnapping) and created an event for one of the individuals.  Now, would you suggest I attach the same event to all three captives, or create one for each with the same type?

I don't see any cons to any of the approaches, but just in case, I'm polling you guys.

Simon

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Re: Kidnapping event

Peter Merchant
On 18/05/17 03:02, Simon C. Tremblay wrote:
Hi everyone,

Turns out I have not one but three of my ancestors who were kidnapped in the Deerfiled, MA raid of February 29, 1704 and were then taken to Montreal, where they married and had many descendants.

To track that, I created a custom event type of Enlèvement (Kidnapping) and created an event for one of the individuals.  Now, would you suggest I attach the same event to all three captives, or create one for each with the same type?

I don't see any cons to any of the approaches, but just in case, I'm polling you guys.

Simon

Personal opinion: All three were kidnapped in the same event, so keep it that way, unless there were differences in the way that they were kidnapped or what happened later that was still part of the event. Future people looking at your data will not be looking for three physical separate kidnappings, and will know that they were kidnapped together.

Peter M.


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Re: Kidnapping event

Brad Rogers
In reply to this post by Simon C. Tremblay
On Wed, 17 May 2017 22:02:52 -0400
"Simon C. Tremblay" <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hello Simon,

>I don't see any cons to any of the approaches, but just in case, I'm
>polling you guys.

I agree with Peter;  use the one event, unless there are significant
differences between the kidnappings.  Although I don't really see how as
they were all kidnapped from and transferred to the same places.  It's
only what happened after the transfer to Montreal that differs.

--
 Regards  _
         / )           "The blindingly obvious is
        / _)rad        never immediately apparent"
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Re: Kidnapping event

paul womack
In reply to this post by Simon C. Tremblay
Simon C. Tremblay wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
> Turns out I have not one but three of my ancestors who were kidnapped in the Deerfiled, MA raid of February 29, 1704 and were then taken to Montreal, where they married and had many descendants.
>
> To track that, I created a custom event type of Enlèvement (Kidnapping) and created an event for one of the individuals.  Now, would you suggest I attach the same event to all three captives, or create one for each with the same type?
>
> I don't see any cons to any of the approaches, but just in case, I'm polling you guys.

It sounds to me like a single mass kidnapping, so single Event.

While I'm here - it's not a right/wrong thing, but I've defined a custom "Crime" event,
and I put the type of crime (fraud, assault, theft etc) in the Description. In my database
I would have probably had a Kidnapping "Crime".

Just an alternative. There's always a conflict between fine granularity
("accuracy") and coarse granularity ("structure").

   BugBear


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Re: Kidnapping event

Dave Scheipers
Hi All,

I have found similar events where relatives have been taken by the Indians or by the Indians for the French. I have used "Captured" as the event type. I think of Kidnapped as taking for ransom.

And I share the event with those taken together so long as they each have the same citation which has been the case so far.

Dave

On Thu, May 18, 2017 at 4:55 AM, paul womack <[hidden email]> wrote:
Simon C. Tremblay wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
> Turns out I have not one but three of my ancestors who were kidnapped in the Deerfiled, MA raid of February 29, 1704 and were then taken to Montreal, where they married and had many descendants.
>
> To track that, I created a custom event type of Enlèvement (Kidnapping) and created an event for one of the individuals.  Now, would you suggest I attach the same event to all three captives, or create one for each with the same type?
>
> I don't see any cons to any of the approaches, but just in case, I'm polling you guys.

It sounds to me like a single mass kidnapping, so single Event.

While I'm here - it's not a right/wrong thing, but I've defined a custom "Crime" event,
and I put the type of crime (fraud, assault, theft etc) in the Description. In my database
I would have probably had a Kidnapping "Crime".

Just an alternative. There's always a conflict between fine granularity
("accuracy") and coarse granularity ("structure").

   BugBear


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Re: Kidnapping event

Brad Rogers
On Thu, 18 May 2017 10:00:27 -0400
Dave Scheipers <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hello Dave,

>or by the Indians for the French. I have used "Captured" as the event
>type. I think of Kidnapped as taking for ransom.

Captured seems too vague to me;  Could be during war or peace.  Could be
a prisoner/criminal on the run, etc. and is often done quite legally.
Agreed, kidnapping usually involve demands for ransom, but not
exclusively so and is definitely far more pertinent to Simon's use case.

--
 Regards  _
         / )           "The blindingly obvious is
        / _)rad        never immediately apparent"
Why do they try to hide our past pulling down houses and build car parks
Bricks & Mortar - The Jam

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Re: Kidnapping event

Dave Scheipers
Any event that would have Captured or Kidnapped would have either a detail description or an attached note so the vagary of the event type doesn't pose a problem for me. And yes, I could see Captured used in many other situations that you describe. So it is up to the user how many custom events are created and how they are used.

Just offering my experience and what I have done, Dave


On Thu, May 18, 2017 at 10:19 AM, Brad Rogers <[hidden email]> wrote:
On Thu, 18 May 2017 10:00:27 -0400
Dave Scheipers <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hello Dave,

>or by the Indians for the French. I have used "Captured" as the event
>type. I think of Kidnapped as taking for ransom.

Captured seems too vague to me;  Could be during war or peace.  Could be
a prisoner/criminal on the run, etc. and is often done quite legally.
Agreed, kidnapping usually involve demands for ransom, but not
exclusively so and is definitely far more pertinent to Simon's use case.

--
 Regards  _
         / )           "The blindingly obvious is
        / _)rad        never immediately apparent"
Why do they try to hide our past pulling down houses and build car parks
Bricks & Mortar - The Jam

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Re: Kidnapping event

Simon C. Tremblay
Thanks for all your comments. The case for the single event is quite clear.  I can also add to it refrences like this one http://www.babcock-acres.com/Misceallaneous/deerfield_captives_of_1704.htm that lists the fate of all captives.

As for the wording, captured/kidnapped/abducted, I see your point Dave, but my personnal choice will be kidnapping (Enlèvement, in my case) because as you can see in the list above, some of the captive were ransomned as well.

Thank you all,

Regards

Simon



On 18 May 2017 at 10:35, Dave Scheipers <[hidden email]> wrote:
Any event that would have Captured or Kidnapped would have either a detail description or an attached note so the vagary of the event type doesn't pose a problem for me. And yes, I could see Captured used in many other situations that you describe. So it is up to the user how many custom events are created and how they are used.

Just offering my experience and what I have done, Dave


On Thu, May 18, 2017 at 10:19 AM, Brad Rogers <[hidden email]> wrote:
On Thu, 18 May 2017 10:00:27 -0400
Dave Scheipers <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hello Dave,

>or by the Indians for the French. I have used "Captured" as the event
>type. I think of Kidnapped as taking for ransom.

Captured seems too vague to me;  Could be during war or peace.  Could be
a prisoner/criminal on the run, etc. and is often done quite legally.
Agreed, kidnapping usually involve demands for ransom, but not
exclusively so and is definitely far more pertinent to Simon's use case.

--
 Regards  _
         / )           "The blindingly obvious is
        / _)rad        never immediately apparent"
Why do they try to hide our past pulling down houses and build car parks
Bricks & Mortar - The Jam

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Re: Kidnapping event

Brad Rogers
In reply to this post by Dave Scheipers
On Thu, 18 May 2017 10:35:07 -0400
Dave Scheipers <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hello Dave,

>Just offering my experience and what I have done, Dave

Understood;  Different mindsets, different work techniques, no one right
way, etc.

--
 Regards  _
         / )           "The blindingly obvious is
        / _)rad        never immediately apparent"
You don't entertain ideas you simply bore them
I Don't Like You - Stiff Little Fingers

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