Wars/Concentration camps/Repressions/Disposession

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Wars/Concentration camps/Repressions/Disposession

szulicki
Hi Folks,

Could you please share your ideas re how it is possible to show reflect the
following events?

Wars
Concentration camps
Repressions
Disposession

Also, what about military awards? Show they just be added as media or there
is some other place, specially dedicated for that?



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Re: Wars/Concentration camps/Repressions/Disposession

Ron Johnson
On 9/27/19 11:24 AM, szulicki wrote:
> Hi Folks,
>
> Could you please share your ideas re how it is possible to show reflect the
> following events?
>
> Wars
> Concentration camps

I'd enter those as custom Events.

> Repressions
> Disposession

Please be more specific.  (But probably custom events.)

> Also, what about military awards? Show they just be added as media or there
> is some other place, specially dedicated for that?

Attributes and notes, maybe?   Also maybe Events of type Military Service.

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Re: Wars/Concentration camps/Repressions/Disposession

Brad Rogers
In reply to this post by szulicki
On Fri, 27 Sep 2019 11:24:49 -0500 (CDT)
szulicki <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hello szulicki,

>following events?
>
>Wars
>Concentration camps

I'm intrigued.  In what way is a concentration camp an event?

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Re: Wars/Concentration camps/Repressions/Disposession

szulicki
Hi Brad,

According to the Cambridge Dictionary, the event is "anything that happens, especially something unusual".

Definitely, the term event may not sound nice with regards to the concentration camp, however, I believe, it is fair to have a possibility to reflect when a person got there and the section with events is the only way I can imagine it

Kindest Regards,
Eugene

On Sat, Sep 28, 2019, 9:05 AM Brad Rogers <[hidden email]> wrote:
On Fri, 27 Sep 2019 11:24:49 -0500 (CDT)
szulicki <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hello szulicki,

>following events?
>
>Wars
>Concentration camps

I'm intrigued.  In what way is a concentration camp an event?

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Re: Wars/Concentration camps/Repressions/Disposession

Brad Rogers
On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 09:21:56 +0200
Ievgenii Shulitskyi <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hello Ievgenii,

>reflect when a person got there and the section with events is the only
>way

I'd opt for the Event being an Internment, occurring at a place of
Type Concentration Camp.  Or, more generally, Prison Camp.

That said, until I had more than a handful of Camps, I use a custom
place type of Institution - with a note, if the name doesn't make it
clear - to avoid cluttering the type list.

If it's common for the institution to have the type included in its name
(for example, West Street Primary School or Hammersmith Hospital) I stick
with Institution.  Thus far, the only exception to that rule I've made is
for a custom place type of Church.

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Re: Wars/Concentration camps/Repressions/Disposession

Peter Merchant
In reply to this post by szulicki
On 28/09/2019 08:21, Ievgenii Shulitskyi wrote:
Hi Brad,

According to the Cambridge Dictionary, the event is "anything that happens, especially something unusual".

Definitely, the term event may not sound nice with regards to the concentration camp, however, I believe, it is fair to have a possibility to reflect when a person got there and the section with events is the only way I can imagine it

Kindest Regards,
Eugene

On Sat, Sep 28, 2019, 9:05 AM Brad Rogers <[hidden email]> wrote:
On Fri, 27 Sep 2019 11:24:49 -0500 (CDT)
szulicki <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hello szulicki,

>following events?
>
>Wars
>Concentration camps

I'm intrigued.  In what way is a concentration camp an event?

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Surely the event should be 'Internment' and the Place a 'concentration camp'?

Peter M.



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Re: Wars/Concentration camps/Repressions/Disposession

Ron Johnson
In reply to this post by Brad Rogers
On 9/28/19 2:05 AM, Brad Rogers wrote:
On Fri, 27 Sep 2019 11:24:49 -0500 (CDT)
szulicki [hidden email] wrote:

Hello szulicki,

following events?

Wars
Concentration camps
I'm intrigued.  In what way is a concentration camp an event?

Living in a concentration camp is an event.

Technically, it's a Residence event, but... no.  I wouldn't classify being interred in Sobibor a Residence event.


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Re: Wars/Concentration camps/Repressions/Disposession

GRAMPS - User mailing list
Perhaps not, but it is the event that > at this moment < is the best fit.

Ron Johnson wrote:
On 9/28/19 2:05 AM, Brad Rogers wrote:
On Fri, 27 Sep 2019 11:24:49 -0500 (CDT)
szulicki [hidden email] wrote:

Hello szulicki,

following events?

Wars
Concentration camps
I'm intrigued.  In what way is a concentration camp an event?

Living in a concentration camp is an event.

Technically, it's a Residence event, but... no.  I wouldn't classify being interred in Sobibor a Residence event.


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Re: Wars/Concentration camps/Repressions/Disposession

Ron Johnson
Given that events can have date ranges, I'm confused by what you are saying.

On 9/28/19 5:10 AM, Dirk Munk via Gramps-users wrote:
Perhaps not, but it is the event that > at this moment < is the best fit.

Ron Johnson wrote:
On 9/28/19 2:05 AM, Brad Rogers wrote:
On Fri, 27 Sep 2019 11:24:49 -0500 (CDT)
szulicki [hidden email] wrote:

Hello szulicki,

following events?

Wars
Concentration camps
I'm intrigued.  In what way is a concentration camp an event?

Living in a concentration camp is an event.

Technically, it's a Residence event, but... no.  I wouldn't classify being interred in Sobibor a Residence event.

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Re: Wars/Concentration camps/Repressions/Disposession

szulicki
In reply to this post by GRAMPS - User mailing list
Folks,

Thanks for your inputs! I think I will follow what was suggested by Rob and create custom events:

Imprisonment (not sure yet if it is worth to include there both 'regular' imprisonment events and such things as concentration camps or to separate the latter)
Dispossession (or dekulakization, sounds strange to me but that's the derivative from the original term)
Gulag (need to think of it. Technically, it is both imprisonment and the camp)
Repression (I think of this as a compilation of residence event and imprisonment, so-called "kulatskaya ssylka", or just deportation)

On Sat, Sep 28, 2019 at 12:34 PM Dirk Munk via Gramps-users <[hidden email]> wrote:
Perhaps not, but it is the event that > at this moment < is the best fit.

Ron Johnson wrote:
On 9/28/19 2:05 AM, Brad Rogers wrote:
On Fri, 27 Sep 2019 11:24:49 -0500 (CDT)
szulicki [hidden email] wrote:

Hello szulicki,

following events?

Wars
Concentration camps
I'm intrigued.  In what way is a concentration camp an event?

Living in a concentration camp is an event.

Technically, it's a Residence event, but... no.  I wouldn't classify being interred in Sobibor a Residence event.


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Re: Wars/Concentration camps/Repressions/Disp

GRAMPS - User mailing list
You might want to use interment instead? It is more generic.

This would support poor house & asylum commitments too. But it might offend some people who think of interment as only being the specific standard type 'Burial'. (What about inurnments or entombments?)

-Brian

On Sat, Sep 28, 2019 at 5:50, Ievgenii Shulitskyi


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Re: Wars/Concentration camps/Repressions/Disp

GRAMPS - User mailing list
My bad!  

Interment : placement of a corpse
Internment : the state of being confined

-Brian

On Sat, Sep 28, 2019 at 6:14, [hidden email]
You might want to use interment instead? It is more generic.

This would support poor house & asylum commitments too. But it might offend some people who think of interment as only being the specific standard type 'Burial'. (What about inurnments or entombments?)

-Brian


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Re: Wars/Concentration camps/Repressions/Disp

Brad Rogers
In reply to this post by GRAMPS - User mailing list
On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 11:14:31 +0000 (UTC)
Emyoulation--- via Gramps-users <[hidden email]>
wrote:

Hello Emyoulation---,

>some people who think of interment as only being the specific standard
>type 'Burial'. (What about inurnments or entombments?)

Interment  = Burial
 not to be confused with
Internment = Imprisonment

They're two different but, admittedly, very similar sounding words.

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Re: Wars/Concentration camps/Repressions/Disposession

GRAMPS - User mailing list
In reply to this post by Ron Johnson
Sobibor and Auschwitz-Birkenau were extermination camps, not concentration camps. There were just a few extermination camps, and those were set up to murder as many people as possible as fast as possible.

However, there were hundreds of concentration camps where many people died, but mostly not shortly after they arrived. Sometimes it took weeks, sometimes months or years. People also survived concentration camps, some were even released.

Ron Johnson wrote:
Given that events can have date ranges, I'm confused by what you are saying.

On 9/28/19 5:10 AM, Dirk Munk via Gramps-users wrote:
Perhaps not, but it is the event that > at this moment < is the best fit.

Ron Johnson wrote:
On 9/28/19 2:05 AM, Brad Rogers wrote:
On Fri, 27 Sep 2019 11:24:49 -0500 (CDT)
szulicki [hidden email] wrote:

Hello szulicki,

following events?

Wars
Concentration camps
I'm intrigued.  In what way is a concentration camp an event?

Living in a concentration camp is an event.

Technically, it's a Residence event, but... no.  I wouldn't classify being interred in Sobibor a Residence event.

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Re: Wars/Concentration camps/Repressions/Disposession

Nick Hall
In reply to this post by Brad Rogers
On 28/09/2019 08:51, Brad Rogers wrote:
> I'd opt for the Event being an Internment, occurring at a place of
> Type Concentration Camp.  Or, more generally, Prison Camp.

Yes.  Internment has previously been suggested as a military event for
prisoners of war.  It would also be valid as a political event type.

See:

https://gramps-project.org/wiki/index.php/Custom_Event_Types


Nick.




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Re: Wars/Concentration camps/Repressions/Disposession

Patrice Legoux
In reply to this post by szulicki
Hi,

Deportation as event with deportation camp name as place. As said with a concentration camp or prison place name type. 

Dispossessions as note of the Deportation event,  or a second new Spoliation event to describe what was taken/stolen.

Patrice

Le sam. 28 sept. 2019 à 12:51, Ievgenii Shulitskyi <[hidden email]> a écrit :
Folks,

Thanks for your inputs! I think I will follow what was suggested by Rob and create custom events:

Imprisonment (not sure yet if it is worth to include there both 'regular' imprisonment events and such things as concentration camps or to separate the latter)
Dispossession (or dekulakization, sounds strange to me but that's the derivative from the original term)
Gulag (need to think of it. Technically, it is both imprisonment and the camp)
Repression (I think of this as a compilation of residence event and imprisonment, so-called "kulatskaya ssylka", or just deportation)

On Sat, Sep 28, 2019 at 12:34 PM Dirk Munk via Gramps-users <[hidden email]> wrote:
Perhaps not, but it is the event that > at this moment < is the best fit.

Ron Johnson wrote:
On 9/28/19 2:05 AM, Brad Rogers wrote:
On Fri, 27 Sep 2019 11:24:49 -0500 (CDT)
szulicki [hidden email] wrote:

Hello szulicki,

following events?

Wars
Concentration camps
I'm intrigued.  In what way is a concentration camp an event?

Living in a concentration camp is an event.

Technically, it's a Residence event, but... no.  I wouldn't classify being interred in Sobibor a Residence event.


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Re: Wars/Concentration camps/Repressions/Disposession

Ron Johnson
In reply to this post by GRAMPS - User mailing list

Enough weren't immediately massacred that they were able to revolt, slay many guards, and escape.


On 9/28/19 6:56 AM, Dirk Munk via Gramps-users wrote:
Sobibor and Auschwitz-Birkenau were extermination camps, not concentration camps. There were just a few extermination camps, and those were set up to murder as many people as possible as fast as possible.

However, there were hundreds of concentration camps where many people died, but mostly not shortly after they arrived. Sometimes it took weeks, sometimes months or years. People also survived concentration camps, some were even released.

Ron Johnson wrote:
Given that events can have date ranges, I'm confused by what you are saying.

On 9/28/19 5:10 AM, Dirk Munk via Gramps-users wrote:
Perhaps not, but it is the event that > at this moment < is the best fit.

Ron Johnson wrote:
On 9/28/19 2:05 AM, Brad Rogers wrote:
On Fri, 27 Sep 2019 11:24:49 -0500 (CDT)
szulicki [hidden email] wrote:

Hello szulicki,

following events?

Wars
Concentration camps
I'm intrigued.  In what way is a concentration camp an event?

Living in a concentration camp is an event.

Technically, it's a Residence event, but... no.  I wouldn't classify being interred in Sobibor a Residence event.


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