Where are custom event types stored and is there a way to edit/remove custom event types?

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Where are custom event types stored and is there a way to edit/remove custom event types?

John W. Kitz-3
Hi,

Some time ago I had an exchange of views with some subscribers to this list
about the need for additional out-off-the-box values to indicate the status
of a relationship between two individuals e.g. in those cases that one
individual dies and the other remarries to avoid data suggesting bigamy of
the remaining partner to the relationship.

While not discussed the same applies for any custom events types that one
may need, but that are not available out-off-the-box.

Some argued that such a need does not exist, others hinted at the fact that
this can be solved by simply adding any additional values that one may need
in the appropriate fields in the software.

The obvious downside of this workaround is that the resulting data is likely
going to contain different values depending on who entered them, which in
turn is likely to negatively affect the quality of data and the ability to
exchange data with others.

Considering the above and the fact that I am aware of the existence of the
Rename Event Types tool I'd appreciate it if someone were to let me known
were any custom values entered by the end-user are stored and how to edit
and remove them should the need arise?

Regards, Jk.


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Re: Where are custom event types stored and is there a way to edit/remove custom event types?

Dave Scheipers
Hi JK,

I am not sure where or how custom event types are stored. But....

One of the major drawbacks is that these events types are not translated if you print a report out into another language. It became very clear to me when I exchanged reports with a newly discovered cousin, and fellow family genealogist, in the Netherlands. My custom events stayed in English while out-of-the-box events translated nicely.

If you know about the Rename Event Types tool, then you already know how to edit your events to be consistent across your database. The trick is to remove the now unused/unwanted type.

To remove these from the drop-down lists, you will need to import your most recent (minutes old) backup into a new empty database.

I do this every few months. My biggest offending event types are the events that get saved with a date in the event type field. I quickly correct my error, but the errant types remain in the drop-down list until I do the clean import.

A while back, NickH asked about what we would like to see in future improvements. I asked for more control over event types and at the time, I was thinking about being able to have our custom events grouped along with the set events or creating our own groupings. See how custom events are grouped in the Complete individual Report as an example. Now I see it would need to be even more involved to be able to handle translations (if needed/wanted).

Don't know if this helps... Dave.

On Thu, Mar 16, 2017 at 5:19 PM, John W. Kitz <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi,

Some time ago I had an exchange of views with some subscribers to this list
about the need for additional out-off-the-box values to indicate the status
of a relationship between two individuals e.g. in those cases that one
individual dies and the other remarries to avoid data suggesting bigamy of
the remaining partner to the relationship.

While not discussed the same applies for any custom events types that one
may need, but that are not available out-off-the-box.

Some argued that such a need does not exist, others hinted at the fact that
this can be solved by simply adding any additional values that one may need
in the appropriate fields in the software.

The obvious downside of this workaround is that the resulting data is likely
going to contain different values depending on who entered them, which in
turn is likely to negatively affect the quality of data and the ability to
exchange data with others.

Considering the above and the fact that I am aware of the existence of the
Rename Event Types tool I'd appreciate it if someone were to let me known
were any custom values entered by the end-user are stored and how to edit
and remove them should the need arise?

Regards, Jk.


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Re: Where are custom event types stored and is there a way to edit/remove custom event types?

Paul Franklin-5
> One of the major drawbacks is that these events types are not translated if
> you print a report out into another language.

> Now I see it would
> need to be even more involved to be able to handle translations (if
> needed/wanted).

I am by no means an expert but I suspect it would be even
more difficult than that.  8-)

Besides having to come up with some system whereby a
user was able to enter in her own translations to anything
custom, in whatever language(s) deemed appropriate, it
is also the case that the actual translations used are in a
binary (compiled) form, so that would somehow need to
be taken care also.

Perhaps a motivated power user could do it, for their own
personal use, but I'm guessing it'd be hard to generalize
the whole process.

But I am just guessing.  8-)

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Re: Where are custom event types stored and is there a way to edit/remove custom event types?

Dave Scheipers
Hi Paul,
The most I know about python and Gramps' structure is looking at some of the py files. The only alteration I have made is to keep places from opening in the expanded tree when selecting existing places. And Nick posted where and what line had to change.

However, I can envision what I want would look like.

It would involve a tool to access a background database. The db would contain the absolute minimum event types, BMD etc. The main fields would be the Type and a Group (expandable drop-down list) and a drop-down (finite) field for the language. Below this would be a list to add any additional languages. So in my case I would add the language Dutch; and then in the field put in the translation. If I needed another language, I could add the 2nd, 3rd... language. Of course, Gramps will know which languages I installed.

Compounding the translation issue is logging all of the permutations of what would be needed for reports. The basic 'Birth' as type has birth and born stored somewhere and gramps knows which to use when, and that would need to happen for each custom event.

Using the Complete Individual Record as an example, it shows which groups are set and which ones to be included. This would have to be altered to allow for the new fluid nature of Groups.

And I have absolutely no idea if any of that would be possible.

If you don't hear it enough, if at all, Thank You for what you and all the other developers have created and keep moving forward, Dave

On Thu, Mar 16, 2017 at 8:20 PM, Paul Franklin <[hidden email]> wrote:
> One of the major drawbacks is that these events types are not translated if
> you print a report out into another language.

> Now I see it would
> need to be even more involved to be able to handle translations (if
> needed/wanted).

I am by no means an expert but I suspect it would be even
more difficult than that.  8-)

Besides having to come up with some system whereby a
user was able to enter in her own translations to anything
custom, in whatever language(s) deemed appropriate, it
is also the case that the actual translations used are in a
binary (compiled) form, so that would somehow need to
be taken care also.

Perhaps a motivated power user could do it, for their own
personal use, but I'm guessing it'd be hard to generalize
the whole process.

But I am just guessing.  8-)

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Re: Where are custom event types stored and is there a way to edit/remove custom event types?

Rich Lakey
I have 20 custom event types of which I only created one!  Does everyone else have all these custom event types. Looking at them I do not believe they are original to Gramps.  I am suspecting that Gramps builds these custom event types when a DB in imported and it reads the event types when it builds the DB. I am guessing mine came from my original GEDCOM import. Using a filter I found one peculiar looking event type "Other-Begin" only occurs once in my DB. I will try to remove it tomorrow and see if that custom event type disappears.
Rich

On 03/16/2017 09:04 PM, Dave Scheipers wrote:
Hi Paul,
The most I know about python and Gramps' structure is looking at some of the py files. The only alteration I have made is to keep places from opening in the expanded tree when selecting existing places. And Nick posted where and what line had to change.

However, I can envision what I want would look like.

It would involve a tool to access a background database. The db would contain the absolute minimum event types, BMD etc. The main fields would be the Type and a Group (expandable drop-down list) and a drop-down (finite) field for the language. Below this would be a list to add any additional languages. So in my case I would add the language Dutch; and then in the field put in the translation. If I needed another language, I could add the 2nd, 3rd... language. Of course, Gramps will know which languages I installed.

Compounding the translation issue is logging all of the permutations of what would be needed for reports. The basic 'Birth' as type has birth and born stored somewhere and gramps knows which to use when, and that would need to happen for each custom event.

Using the Complete Individual Record as an example, it shows which groups are set and which ones to be included. This would have to be altered to allow for the new fluid nature of Groups.

And I have absolutely no idea if any of that would be possible.

If you don't hear it enough, if at all, Thank You for what you and all the other developers have created and keep moving forward, Dave

On Thu, Mar 16, 2017 at 8:20 PM, Paul Franklin <[hidden email]> wrote:
> One of the major drawbacks is that these events types are not translated if
> you print a report out into another language.

> Now I see it would
> need to be even more involved to be able to handle translations (if
> needed/wanted).

I am by no means an expert but I suspect it would be even
more difficult than that.  8-)

Besides having to come up with some system whereby a
user was able to enter in her own translations to anything
custom, in whatever language(s) deemed appropriate, it
is also the case that the actual translations used are in a
binary (compiled) form, so that would somehow need to
be taken care also.

Perhaps a motivated power user could do it, for their own
personal use, but I'm guessing it'd be hard to generalize
the whole process.

But I am just guessing.  8-)

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Re: Where are custom event types stored and is there a way to edit/remove custom event types?

paul womack
In reply to this post by Dave Scheipers
Dave Scheipers wrote:
> Hi JK,
>
> I am not sure where or how custom event types are stored. But....
>
> One of the major drawbacks is that these events types are not translated if you print a report out into another language.

And yet Custom Events (and roles) are often the best way to cleanly represent
some records.

As long as a data set stays in the languages of its user(s), the translation problem
does not arise, I think, and this seems likely.

   BugBear

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Re: Where are custom event types stored and is there a way to edit/remove custom event types?

jerome
In reply to this post by John W. Kitz-3
> Where are custom event types stored

Most into metadata table. Some moons ago,
=> url_types, pevent_names, name_types, fevent_names, family_rels, child_refs, sm_types, repo_types, pattr_names, origin_types, note_types, fattr_names

I looked at them on bug report #6934

e.g., db5.1_dump -p meta_data.db

Some are specific to primary objects (tables)

person => name_origine, name_type, attribute_on_event_ref, person attribute
family => fam_relation,_attribute_on_ fam_event, fam_attribute
event => fam_event, attribute_on_custom_event, attribute_on_event
etc ...


Hope this can help.
J.

--------------------------------------------
En date de : Jeu 16.3.17, Dave Scheipers <[hidden email]> a écrit :

 Objet: Re: [Gramps-users] Where are custom event types stored and is there a way to edit/remove custom event types?
 À: [hidden email]
 Cc: "Gramps users" <[hidden email]>
 Date: Jeudi 16 mars 2017, 23h01
 
 Hi
 JK,
 I am not sure where or how custom event types are
 stored. But....
 One of the major drawbacks is that these events
 types are not translated if you print a report out into
 another language. It became very clear to me when I
 exchanged reports with a newly discovered cousin, and fellow
 family genealogist, in the Netherlands. My custom events
 stayed in English while out-of-the-box events translated
 nicely.
 If you know about the Rename Event Types tool,
 then you already know how to edit your events to be
 consistent across your database. The trick is to remove the
 now unused/unwanted type.
 To remove these from the drop-down lists, you
 will need to import your most recent (minutes old) backup
 into a new empty database.
 I do this every few months. My biggest offending
 event types are the events that get saved with a date in the
 event type field. I quickly correct my error, but the errant
 types remain in the drop-down list until I do the clean
 import.
 A while back, NickH asked about what we would
 like to see in future improvements. I asked for more control
 over event types and at the time, I was thinking about being
 able to have our custom events grouped along with the set
 events or creating our own groupings. See how custom events
 are grouped in the Complete individual Report as an example.
 Now I see it would need to be even more involved to be able
 to handle translations (if needed/wanted).
 Don't know if this helps...
 Dave.
 On Thu, Mar 16, 2017
 at 5:19 PM, John W. Kitz <[hidden email]>
 wrote:
 Hi,
 
 
 
 Some time ago I had an exchange of views with some
 subscribers to this list
 
 about the need for additional out-off-the-box values to
 indicate the status
 
 of a relationship between two individuals e.g. in those
 cases that one
 
 individual dies and the other remarries to avoid data
 suggesting bigamy of
 
 the remaining partner to the relationship.
 
 
 
 While not discussed the same applies for any custom events
 types that one
 
 may need, but that are not available out-off-the-box.
 
 
 
 Some argued that such a need does not exist, others hinted
 at the fact that
 
 this can be solved by simply adding any additional values
 that one may need
 
 in the appropriate fields in the software.
 
 
 
 The obvious downside of this workaround is that the
 resulting data is likely
 
 going to contain different values depending on who entered
 them, which in
 
 turn is likely to negatively affect the quality of data and
 the ability to
 
 exchange data with others.
 
 
 
 Considering the above and the fact that I am aware of the
 existence of the
 
 Rename Event Types tool I'd appreciate it if someone
 were to let me known
 
 were any custom values entered by the end-user are stored
 and how to edit
 
 and remove them should the need arise?
 
 
 
 Regards, Jk.
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: Where are custom event types stored and is there a way to edit/remove custom event types?

Rich Lakey
In reply to this post by Rich Lakey
I got some time to look at the event custom Types I have.  "Other-Begin" is used in FTM which is where my original GEDCOM came from.
I changed my one instance of "Other-Begin" to my custom "Partner".  This did not get rid of the custom type "Other-Begin". But I then exported my DB and imported into new empty DB.  The custom event type "Other-Begin" disappeared.  So barring real info from someone who knows, I am assuming what I guessed last night is true.  On import of a DB Gramps builds a list of custom types and stores them in the DB its-self. So it is not possible for a mere mortal like me to edit the custom types. But I can change the custom types I have in the event records and the next time the DB is exported and imported the types will resolve themselves.
Rich



On 03/16/2017 09:39 PM, Rich wrote:
I have 20 custom event types of which I only created one!  Does everyone else have all these custom event types. Looking at them I do not believe they are original to Gramps.  I am suspecting that Gramps builds these custom event types when a DB in imported and it reads the event types when it builds the DB. I am guessing mine came from my original GEDCOM import. Using a filter I found one peculiar looking event type "Other-Begin" only occurs once in my DB. I will try to remove it tomorrow and see if that custom event type disappears.
Rich

On 03/16/2017 09:04 PM, Dave Scheipers wrote:
Hi Paul,
The most I know about python and Gramps' structure is looking at some of the py files. The only alteration I have made is to keep places from opening in the expanded tree when selecting existing places. And Nick posted where and what line had to change.

However, I can envision what I want would look like.

It would involve a tool to access a background database. The db would contain the absolute minimum event types, BMD etc. The main fields would be the Type and a Group (expandable drop-down list) and a drop-down (finite) field for the language. Below this would be a list to add any additional languages. So in my case I would add the language Dutch; and then in the field put in the translation. If I needed another language, I could add the 2nd, 3rd... language. Of course, Gramps will know which languages I installed.

Compounding the translation issue is logging all of the permutations of what would be needed for reports. The basic 'Birth' as type has birth and born stored somewhere and gramps knows which to use when, and that would need to happen for each custom event.

Using the Complete Individual Record as an example, it shows which groups are set and which ones to be included. This would have to be altered to allow for the new fluid nature of Groups.

And I have absolutely no idea if any of that would be possible.

If you don't hear it enough, if at all, Thank You for what you and all the other developers have created and keep moving forward, Dave

On Thu, Mar 16, 2017 at 8:20 PM, Paul Franklin <[hidden email]> wrote:
> One of the major drawbacks is that these events types are not translated if
> you print a report out into another language.

> Now I see it would
> need to be even more involved to be able to handle translations (if
> needed/wanted).

I am by no means an expert but I suspect it would be even
more difficult than that.  8-)

Besides having to come up with some system whereby a
user was able to enter in her own translations to anything
custom, in whatever language(s) deemed appropriate, it
is also the case that the actual translations used are in a
binary (compiled) form, so that would somehow need to
be taken care also.

Perhaps a motivated power user could do it, for their own
personal use, but I'm guessing it'd be hard to generalize
the whole process.

But I am just guessing.  8-)

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Re: Where are custom event types stored and is there a way to edit/remove custom event types?

Nick Hall
In reply to this post by Dave Scheipers
On 16/03/17 22:01, Dave Scheipers wrote:
> A while back, NickH asked about what we would like to see in future
> improvements. I asked for more control over event types and at the
> time, I was thinking about being able to have our custom events
> grouped along with the set events or creating our own groupings. See
> how custom events are grouped in the Complete individual Report as an
> example. Now I see it would need to be even more involved to be able
> to handle translations (if needed/wanted).
>
Yes.  It would be quite easy to write an editor to manage groups.

Custom event types lack translations and abbreviations (which should
also be translated).  We would also have a translation problem with
user-defined group names.

Nick.



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Re: Where are custom event types stored and is there a way to edit/remove custom event types?

Paul Franklin-5
> Custom event types lack translations and abbreviations (which should
> also be translated).  We would also have a translation problem with
> user-defined group names.

This problem has been thought about for more than a decade.

I suspect if "it was easy it would have been done long ago."

https://gramps-project.org/bugs/view.php?id=725

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Re: Where are custom event types stored and is there a way to edit/remove custom event types?

Nick Hall
On 18/03/17 19:46, Paul Franklin wrote:
Custom event types lack translations and abbreviations (which should
also be translated).  We would also have a translation problem with
user-defined group names.
This problem has been thought about for more than a decade.

I suspect if "it was easy it would have been done long ago."

https://gramps-project.org/bugs/view.php?id=725

Yes.  We could just use a fixed list of group names.  The user could then put event types into these groups.

I don't suggest that we try to translate custom types.

Nick.


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Re: Where are custom event types stored and is there a way to edit/remove custom event types?

paul womack
Nick Hall wrote:

> On 18/03/17 19:46, Paul Franklin wrote:
>>> Custom event types lack translations and abbreviations (which should
>>> also be translated).  We would also have a translation problem with
>>> user-defined group names.
>> This problem has been thought about for more than a decade.
>>
>> I suspect if "it was easy it would have been done long ago."
>>
>> https://gramps-project.org/bugs/view.php?id=725
>>
> Yes.  We could just use a fixed list of group names.  The user could then put event types into these groups.

I would be much more interested in Custom types/roles/place appearing consistently
and correctly in all the drop downs.

   BugBear


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Re: Where are custom event types stored and is there a way to edit/remove custom event types?

Nick Hall
On 20/03/17 09:09, paul womack wrote:
> I would be much more interested in Custom types/roles/place appearing
> consistently
> and correctly in all the drop downs.

I agree.  I am not planning to work on this enhancement.

Nick.


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