latitude longitude

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latitude longitude

bm-7
Hi,

there is a small error in 2.1.xx file _PlaceView.py line 146 :
path = "<a href="http://maps.google.com/?sll=%s,%s">http://maps.google.com/?sll=%s,%s" % (longitude, latitude)
should be
path = "<a href="http://maps.google.com/?sll=%s,%s">http://maps.google.com/?sll=%s,%s" % (latitude, longitude)

I would suggest to add a zoom level:
path = "<a href="http://maps.google.com/?sll=%s,%s&z=15">http://maps.google.com/?sll=%s,%s&z=15" % (latitude, longitude)

as otherwise the zoom level is 17 which out of dense cities is a bit overdone in
my opinion.

For this to work lat and lon must be in decimal notation with . for decimal and
not , (used in many countries).
To make the option google maps on place usefull, as well as to simplify the
reportgenerator I'm making for use in googleearth, I would like to ask again
for a standard on storage of lat and lon in gramps. Throwing an error in the
placeview if wrong input is given.

I would suggest to store it in decimal notation (needed for google maps and
google earth), but allow people to input decimal notation or degree notation.
My preference would be to show degree notation towards the user, as eg
googleearth does.

Is this ok? Is this on the todo list of somebody, or should I just code it, as I
am apparently the first who needs this. If not ok, I would just check in my
report if float(place.get_longitude()) works, and only if so, use it. This
would make the report less usefull for other people off course.

Benny.



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Re: latitude longitude

bm-7
Perhaps it would also be best to follow conventions on the placeview and set
latitude (N/S distinction) before longitude (E/W distinction).

See eg http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geographic_coordinate_system

Benny

Quoting [hidden email]:

> Hi,
>
> there is a small error in 2.1.xx file _PlaceView.py line 146 :
> path = "<a href="http://maps.google.com/?sll=%s,%s">http://maps.google.com/?sll=%s,%s" % (longitude, latitude)
> should be
> path = "<a href="http://maps.google.com/?sll=%s,%s">http://maps.google.com/?sll=%s,%s" % (latitude, longitude)
>
> I would suggest to add a zoom level:
> path = "<a href="http://maps.google.com/?sll=%s,%s&z=15">http://maps.google.com/?sll=%s,%s&z=15" % (latitude, longitude)
>
> as otherwise the zoom level is 17 which out of dense cities is a bit
> overdone in
> my opinion.
>
> For this to work lat and lon must be in decimal notation with . for
> decimal and
> not , (used in many countries).
> To make the option google maps on place usefull, as well as to simplify the
> reportgenerator I'm making for use in googleearth, I would like to ask again
> for a standard on storage of lat and lon in gramps. Throwing an error in the
> placeview if wrong input is given.
>
> I would suggest to store it in decimal notation (needed for google maps and
> google earth), but allow people to input decimal notation or degree notation.
> My preference would be to show degree notation towards the user, as eg
> googleearth does.
>
> Is this ok? Is this on the todo list of somebody, or should I just
> code it, as I
> am apparently the first who needs this. If not ok, I would just check in my
> report if float(place.get_longitude()) works, and only if so, use it. This
> would make the report less usefull for other people off course.
>
> Benny.
>
>
>
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Re: latitude longitude

bm-7
In attachment patch that corrects lat/lon error and changes interface so that
lat is the first and lon the second.

I did not recieve answers yet on the lat/lon field entry: allow user to input
anything (standard gramps) or check if correct decimal/degree entry?

Benny

Quoting [hidden email]:

> Perhaps it would also be best to follow conventions on the placeview and set
> latitude (N/S distinction) before longitude (E/W distinction).
>
> See eg http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geographic_coordinate_system
>
> Benny
>
> Quoting [hidden email]:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> there is a small error in 2.1.xx file _PlaceView.py line 146 :
>> path = "<a href="http://maps.google.com/?sll=%s,%s">http://maps.google.com/?sll=%s,%s" % (longitude, latitude)
>> should be
>> path = "<a href="http://maps.google.com/?sll=%s,%s">http://maps.google.com/?sll=%s,%s" % (latitude, longitude)
>>
>> I would suggest to add a zoom level:
>> path = "<a href="http://maps.google.com/?sll=%s,%s&z=15">http://maps.google.com/?sll=%s,%s&z=15" % (latitude, longitude)
>>
>> as otherwise the zoom level is 17 which out of dense cities is a bit
>> overdone in
>> my opinion.
>>
>> For this to work lat and lon must be in decimal notation with . for
>> decimal and
>> not , (used in many countries).
>> To make the option google maps on place usefull, as well as to simplify the
>> reportgenerator I'm making for use in googleearth, I would like to ask again
>> for a standard on storage of lat and lon in gramps. Throwing an error in the
>> placeview if wrong input is given.
>>
>> I would suggest to store it in decimal notation (needed for google maps and
>> google earth), but allow people to input decimal notation or degree
>> notation.
>> My preference would be to show degree notation towards the user, as eg
>> googleearth does.
>>
>> Is this ok? Is this on the todo list of somebody, or should I just
>> code it, as I
>> am apparently the first who needs this. If not ok, I would just check in my
>> report if float(place.get_longitude()) works, and only if so, use it. This
>> would make the report less usefull for other people off course.
>>
>> Benny.
>>
>>
>>
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>>
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Re: latitude longitude

Alex Roitman
Benny,

On Thu, 2006-10-12 at 19:43 +0200, [hidden email] wrote:
> In attachment patch that corrects lat/lon error and changes interface so that
> lat is the first and lon the second.

Thanks for the patch, I'll see about committing it later today.

> I did not recieve answers yet on the lat/lon field entry: allow user to input
> anything (standard gramps) or check if correct decimal/degree entry?

Unfortunately, I have been lately running between work and fixing
bugs for 2.2.0rc1. Lacking the time to meaningfully contribute,
I usually refrain from responses :-) Sorry, I know it's frustrating.

Since we're preparing for the stable 2.2.0 and are in the deep
freeze at this point, should we make this a post-2.2.0 item?

Also, a few question on this:
1. How does one enter degrees?
   Do people have the degree sign on their keyboards?
2. If not, should we customize the UI to have separate
   fields for degrees, minutes, and seconds? In that case,
   each of those could be a decimal number, right?
3. Should we have a tool to batch-convert between different
   representation? And maybe a button to convert the single
   instance?

Alex

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Re: latitude longitude

Serge Noiraud-2
Le/The Jeudi 12 Octobre 2006 19:58, Alex Roitman a écrit/wrote :

> Benny,
>
> On Thu, 2006-10-12 at 19:43 +0200, [hidden email] wrote:
> > In attachment patch that corrects lat/lon error and changes interface so that
> > lat is the first and lon the second.
>
> Thanks for the patch, I'll see about committing it later today.
>
> > I did not recieve answers yet on the lat/lon field entry: allow user to input
> > anything (standard gramps) or check if correct decimal/degree entry?
>
> Unfortunately, I have been lately running between work and fixing
> bugs for 2.2.0rc1. Lacking the time to meaningfully contribute,
> I usually refrain from responses :-) Sorry, I know it's frustrating.
>
> Since we're preparing for the stable 2.2.0 and are in the deep
> freeze at this point, should we make this a post-2.2.0 item?
>
> Also, a few question on this:
> 1. How does one enter degrees?
>    Do people have the degree sign on their keyboards?
On french keyboard : yes.
> 2. If not, should we customize the UI to have separate
>    fields for degrees, minutes, and seconds? In that case,
>    each of those could be a decimal number, right?
Why not !
for exemple, if we have a two digit field, is it possible to go to the next field automaticaly
when the two digits are entered?
> 3. Should we have a tool to batch-convert between different
>    representation? And maybe a button to convert the single
>    instance?
do you mean decimal/degree conversion ?
Can we have a uniq database type and a UI mode type.
This database type could be an ISO normalisation : ISO6709
This is the format used for geographic data exchange standards.
The view and Edit in graphical mode should be on option for decimal/degree ( global option ).
In this case, is a batch-convert tool necessary ? We only use functions to convert decimal/degree to/from the
ISO6709 standard ?

Did I miss something ?
>
> Alex
>

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Re: latitude longitude

bm-7
Hi,

This iso6709 standard (see eg http://www.geocities.com/jusjih/iso6709-en.html)
is somewhat broader that I hoped for.

I must say that only now I noted that my UK qwerty keyboard does not
contain the
degree sign. However, google earth, on asking property of a location
does return
a format like  50°52'21.92"N. This is for me the easiest way of retrieving
lat/lon of a given place. Many reference note however that the decimal
notation
is quickly becoming the standard, so perhaps googleearth is just playing old
fashion.

I would suggest too leave gramps as it is now. The design in gramps is that
people can enter what they think is right, without checking. Eg, on entering
telephone numbers, nothing stops you from entering letters and gramps does not
oblige you to follow the telephone number ISO standard (should that exist).

I will try to write a converter, converting the user input to valid
latitude/longitude. I would allow all ISO6709 input, as well as input like
50°52'21.92"N. Return value would be tuple with decimal notation. This
converter can then be used before calling google maps, and in the googleearth
report I'm making. Everybody happy. If time, a tool can be written to convert
all lat/lon in the database to a specific format.

Benny

Quoting Serge Noiraud <[hidden email]>:

> Le/The Jeudi 12 Octobre 2006 19:58, Alex Roitman a écrit/wrote :
>> Benny,
>>
>> On Thu, 2006-10-12 at 19:43 +0200, [hidden email] wrote:
>> > In attachment patch that corrects lat/lon error and changes
>> interface so that
>> > lat is the first and lon the second.
>>
>> Thanks for the patch, I'll see about committing it later today.
>>
>> > I did not recieve answers yet on the lat/lon field entry: allow
>> user to input
>> > anything (standard gramps) or check if correct decimal/degree entry?
>>
>> Unfortunately, I have been lately running between work and fixing
>> bugs for 2.2.0rc1. Lacking the time to meaningfully contribute,
>> I usually refrain from responses :-) Sorry, I know it's frustrating.
>>
>> Since we're preparing for the stable 2.2.0 and are in the deep
>> freeze at this point, should we make this a post-2.2.0 item?
>>
>> Also, a few question on this:
>> 1. How does one enter degrees?
>>    Do people have the degree sign on their keyboards?
> On french keyboard : yes.
>> 2. If not, should we customize the UI to have separate
>>    fields for degrees, minutes, and seconds? In that case,
>>    each of those could be a decimal number, right?
> Why not !
> for exemple, if we have a two digit field, is it possible to go to
> the next field automaticaly
> when the two digits are entered?
>> 3. Should we have a tool to batch-convert between different
>>    representation? And maybe a button to convert the single
>>    instance?
> do you mean decimal/degree conversion ?
> Can we have a uniq database type and a UI mode type.
> This database type could be an ISO normalisation : ISO6709
> This is the format used for geographic data exchange standards.
> The view and Edit in graphical mode should be on option for
> decimal/degree ( global option ).
> In this case, is a batch-convert tool necessary ? We only use
> functions to convert decimal/degree to/from the
> ISO6709 standard ?
>
> Did I miss something ?
>>
>> Alex
>>
>



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Re: latitude longitude

bm-7
In reply to this post by Alex Roitman
Alex,

to answer to your three questions:

> Also, a few question on this:
> 1. How does one enter degrees?
>   Do people have the degree sign on their keyboards?

Apparently not all. the one I'm typing on now not. However, one can copy paste
this data from a source easily. Lat/Lon have to be looked up somewhere anyhow.

> 2. If not, should we customize the UI to have separate
>   fields for degrees, minutes, and seconds? In that case,
>   each of those could be a decimal number, right?

Customizing the UI: I think not, the standard is becoming decimal
notation. With
python converting should be not more than a couple of lines of code, so why
bother writing an UI to this specific input type? Some people already
mentioned
preferring to input data in decimal notation

> 3. Should we have a tool to batch-convert between different
>   representation? And maybe a button to convert the single
>   instance?

The tool might be interesting, to have one representation in the entire
database
after eg importing somene elses GEDCOM, ...
I will have to write the convert function for googleearth anyway, so
should not
be too much extra work putting it in a tool.

Question: is there a place/module (a file) to put such a general converter in?
That would be def convertLatLon(Lat, Lon, type="D.D"):


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Re: latitude longitude

bm-7
Hi,

I finished bugtesting the latitude/longitude converter. Quite a bit more work
than expected.

In attachment the file PlaceUtils.py, containing the converter.
I then changed my patch to module _PlaceView.py so that the converter
is called
before calling Google Maps.
Like this people kan input data in degree,minutes,seconds notation, or in
decimal notation. Wrong data will not call up Google Maps with no info (as is
the case now), but will call Google Maps with the description.

The converter is a bit long, I'm sure it can be programmed shorter or
more nice.
Comments are welcome.
I only allow for 2 input types: decimal, eg 56.23187 and degree 50°50'59.60"N.
It is possible however to use the # sign instead of ° (for those who do not
have ° on the keyboard). If someone has a better idea than using #, I'm
intersted (D is no option, it might be the translation of eg N(orth) and is
short for an english word anyway).
Output can be decimal with 4 or 8 decimals, degree-min-sec notation,
ISO D.DDDD
format, ISO DDMM.MMM format or ISO DDMMSS.SSS format. This should cover most
applications I think.

Some Notes:
1/ Running python PlaceUtils.py runs the converter with data that should be
tested. All changes to the file should be compared with an output before
changes are made. This part can be deleted when added to gramps, and put in a
seperate test file.

2/ Internationalization of direction identifier.
This is a diffucult one, as 50°50'59.60"S would be 50°50'59.60"Z in eg Dutch.
I added four literals to be translated, hoping that from the way they are
constructed it is clear for the translator only S needs translating.
Alex, before accepting this code, you might want to take a look at the top of
PlaceUtils.py where these literals are defined. There is a limitation to the
code: the direction MUST be at the back to be recognized, and if a translation
conflicts with english (eg S is translated in N), the translation is rejected.

3/General remark: In dutch localization, I can give the decimal as , or . and
the converter works, as well as calling google maps. However, switching to
english, only . works. This is the disadvantage of storing numbers in the
database as a string. If wanted, this can be remedied by converting , to . in
the converter I suppose.

4/Wy only support decimal degree or the old fashioned input? It should be
straightforward to implement other input methods, eg allow input of
50°50'59.60"Z as 50 50 59.60 Z. I did not do this, as I do not need this, and
the more possible inputs, the more possibilities you input wrong data, but it
is interpreted anyway, just under a different format.
Should some users ask to support other input methods, I am however prepared to
extend the coding if sufficient documentation is given.


Benny

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Re: latitude longitude

Jochen123
Hi!

On Mon, Oct 16, 2006 at 12:01:22AM +0200, [hidden email] wrote:
> I only allow for 2 input types: decimal, eg 56.23187 and degree
> 50°50'59.60"N.
> It is possible however to use the # sign instead of ° (for those who do not
> have ° on the keyboard). If someone has a better idea than using #, I'm
> intersted (D is no option, it might be the translation of eg N(orth) and is
> short for an english word anyway).

A notation like this 50:50:59.60 is used resonably often if it is
difficult to have the degree, minutes and seconds sign. (Note that the
minute and second signs are also problematic, because there are so many
very similar but different versions of those chars.) Also the : as a
separator char is familiar to most people because it is often used in
hour:minute time descriptions.

> 2/ Internationalization of direction identifier.
> This is a diffucult one, as 50°50'59.60"S would be 50°50'59.60"Z in eg
> Dutch.
> I added four literals to be translated, hoping that from the way they are
> constructed it is clear for the translator only S needs translating.
> Alex, before accepting this code, you might want to take a look at the top
> of
> PlaceUtils.py where these literals are defined. There is a limitation to the
> code: the direction MUST be at the back to be recognized, and if a
> translation
> conflicts with english (eg S is translated in N), the translation is
> rejected.

You should probably also allow +/- instead of the difficult to translate
N/S etc. So that 50°50'59.60"S would become -50°50'59.60". That gets rid
of the whole internationalization issue and there is ample precedent for
this format.

Jochen
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Re: latitude longitude

bm-7
In attachment my new version of PlaceUtils.

I added Jochen's suggestion: input can be eg -50:12:56.30. I deleted the
possible input with #.
Furthermore I added the : notation as possible output, and corrected an error.

Concerning the classical input with 50°50'59.60"N which Jochen suggests to
drop, I would like to keep this as this is often the format in which latitude
and longitude are offered on sites or in books.

Benny

Quoting Jochen Topf <[hidden email]>:

> Hi!
>
> On Mon, Oct 16, 2006 at 12:01:22AM +0200, [hidden email] wrote:
>> I only allow for 2 input types: decimal, eg 56.23187 and degree
>> 50°50'59.60"N.
>> It is possible however to use the # sign instead of ° (for those who do not
>> have ° on the keyboard). If someone has a better idea than using #, I'm
>> intersted (D is no option, it might be the translation of eg N(orth) and is
>> short for an english word anyway).
>
> A notation like this 50:50:59.60 is used resonably often if it is
> difficult to have the degree, minutes and seconds sign. (Note that the
> minute and second signs are also problematic, because there are so many
> very similar but different versions of those chars.) Also the : as a
> separator char is familiar to most people because it is often used in
> hour:minute time descriptions.
>
>> 2/ Internationalization of direction identifier.
>> This is a diffucult one, as 50°50'59.60"S would be 50°50'59.60"Z in eg
>> Dutch.
>> I added four literals to be translated, hoping that from the way they are
>> constructed it is clear for the translator only S needs translating.
>> Alex, before accepting this code, you might want to take a look at the top
>> of
>> PlaceUtils.py where these literals are defined. There is a limitation to the
>> code: the direction MUST be at the back to be recognized, and if a
>> translation
>> conflicts with english (eg S is translated in N), the translation is
>> rejected.
>
> You should probably also allow +/- instead of the difficult to translate
> N/S etc. So that 50°50'59.60"S would become -50°50'59.60". That gets rid
> of the whole internationalization issue and there is ample precedent for
> this format.
>
> Jochen
> --
> Jochen Topf  [hidden email]  http://www.remote.org/jochen/  +49-721-388298
>
>
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Re: latitude longitude

Alex Roitman
In reply to this post by bm-7
Benny,

On Thu, 2006-10-12 at 19:43 +0200, [hidden email] wrote:
> In attachment patch that corrects lat/lon error and changes interface so that
> lat is the first and lon the second.

This is finally committed, sorry for the delay.

I did not commit the column order change in the Place View.
The reason is that for the users with the existing custom
column order in the Place View, the patch will break it.
So this change would require a db upgrade step that would
reset place view columns to the default.

No big deal, we will do this next time there's a db upgrade.
I didn't feel that this is a prudent thing now in the deep freeze.

Alex

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Re: latitude longitude

bm-7
> Benny,
>
> On Thu, 2006-10-12 at 19:43 +0200, [hidden email] wrote:
>> In attachment patch that corrects lat/lon error and changes
>> interface so that
>> lat is the first and lon the second.
>
> This is finally committed, sorry for the delay.
Great!

> I did not commit the column order change in the Place View.
> The reason is that for the users with the existing custom
> column order in the Place View, the patch will break it.
> So this change would require a db upgrade step that would
> reset place view columns to the default.

I was not certain of the implications of this change, should have mentioned it
before doing it.

> No big deal, we will do this next time there's a db upgrade.
> I didn't feel that this is a prudent thing now in the deep freeze.

Alex,

concerning the PlaceUtils.py and extra modification to the placeview to
use the
convert utility of latitude and longitude.
Is this acceptable for the next revision of gramps, after 2.2?

Please let me know if changes must be done to make this possible. If
there will
only be time after the release of 2.2 to look at this, no problem, let me know
and I'll bring it up a couple of weeks after release. Hopefully with a
googleearth report to accompany it.

Benny

Quoting Alex Roitman <[hidden email]>:



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Re: latitude longitude

Alex Roitman
On Tue, 2006-10-24 at 14:58 +0200, [hidden email] wrote:

> concerning the PlaceUtils.py and extra modification to the placeview to
> use the
> convert utility of latitude and longitude.
> Is this acceptable for the next revision of gramps, after 2.2?
>
> Please let me know if changes must be done to make this possible. If
> there will
> only be time after the release of 2.2 to look at this, no problem, let me know
> and I'll bring it up a couple of weeks after release. Hopefully with a
> googleearth report to accompany it.
I only briefly looked at it, so I can't really tell if and what changes
are needed, but don't worry, we'll work it out :-)

Let's look at it after 2.2 is out. You don't have to wait 2 weeks
to bring it up :-) I am sure that entering degrees and converting
between different notations is a welcome function and should be
added.

Alex

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Re: latitude longitude

jerome
Why not adding/implement an existing library like
http://pygps.org/#LatLongUTMconversion

And maybe his author could help the gramps' map view project ...
http://pygps.org/#mapview !!!


PS: Sorry, but seems that Serge and me aren't able to post on mailing
list anymore since last 2 days :(
Filter on ".fr" ? :-D




Alex Roitman a écrit :

> On Tue, 2006-10-24 at 14:58 +0200, [hidden email] wrote:
>> concerning the PlaceUtils.py and extra modification to the placeview to
>> use the
>> convert utility of latitude and longitude.
>> Is this acceptable for the next revision of gramps, after 2.2?
>>
>> Please let me know if changes must be done to make this possible. If
>> there will
>> only be time after the release of 2.2 to look at this, no problem, let me know
>> and I'll bring it up a couple of weeks after release. Hopefully with a
>> googleearth report to accompany it.
>
> I only briefly looked at it, so I can't really tell if and what changes
> are needed, but don't worry, we'll work it out :-)
>
> Let's look at it after 2.2 is out. You don't have to wait 2 weeks
> to bring it up :-) I am sure that entering degrees and converting
> between different notations is a welcome function and should be
> added.
>
> Alex
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
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> Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier
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>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
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--
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___________________________________________________________________________
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Re: latitude longitude

bm-7
Jerome,

UTM is a different coordinate system,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Transverse_Mercator_coordinate_system

I do not think this is useful in the context of Gramps.
Should people want UTM, they can export from gramps, convert to decimal
notation
of lat lon with the tool I provided, and then call this library to get UTM.

For an overview of usefull lat/lon backends:
http://tools.wikimedia.de/~magnus/geo/geohack.php?params=43_38_33.24_N_79_23_13.7_W_


Benny

Quoting Jérôme <[hidden email]>:

> Why not adding/implement an existing library like
> http://pygps.org/#LatLongUTMconversion
>
> And maybe his author could help the gramps' map view project ...
> http://pygps.org/#mapview !!!
>
>
> PS: Sorry, but seems that Serge and me aren't able to post on mailing
> list anymore since last 2 days :(
> Filter on ".fr" ? :-D
>
>
>
>
> Alex Roitman a écrit :
>> On Tue, 2006-10-24 at 14:58 +0200, [hidden email] wrote:
>>> concerning the PlaceUtils.py and extra modification to the
>>> placeview to use the
>>> convert utility of latitude and longitude.
>>> Is this acceptable for the next revision of gramps, after 2.2?
>>>
>>> Please let me know if changes must be done to make this possible.
>>> If there will
>>> only be time after the release of 2.2 to look at this, no problem,
>>> let me know
>>> and I'll bring it up a couple of weeks after release. Hopefully with a
>>> googleearth report to accompany it.
>>
>> I only briefly looked at it, so I can't really tell if and what changes
>> are needed, but don't worry, we'll work it out :-)
>>
>> Let's look at it after 2.2 is out. You don't have to wait 2 weeks
>> to bring it up :-) I am sure that entering degrees and converting
>> between different notations is a welcome function and should be
>> added.
>>
>> Alex
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security?
>> Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your
>> job easier
>> Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo
>> http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=121642
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Gramps-devel mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gramps-devel
>
> --
> Jérôme Rapinat
>
>
>
>
>
> ___________________________________________________________________________
> D�ouvrez une nouvelle fa�n d'obtenir des r�onses �toutes vos
> questions ! Profitez des connaissances, des opinions et des
> exp�iences des internautes sur Yahoo! Questions/R�onses
> http://fr.answers.yahoo.com
>
>
>
>



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